Questions to Digest

[Fraido]

You can, actually. It's the same location as the thank button is if you're using the site. I don't know about any apps though.

Yeah, it doesn't work on Tapatalk.

[Eric Alan]

*points at my rep bar* That wasn't you?

I thought that was a mod thing. If it isn't then I am wrong about that and I will apologize for that misunderstanding.

Anyone has the ability to give reputation - either positive or negative. There's a +R- button at the bottom of every post for this purpose. Vindictive use of this system is not permitted, and is stated as much in the site's TOS.

[Fraido]

Mice don't have any capacity of intelligence other than running around, pooping, eating, and reproducing.

they are stupid animals that don't seem to recognize danger unless they are wild. It's as if they don't have any proper instincts at birth.

I may be mixing information about mice and hamsters though...

"...They are highly social, playful, curious, affectionate, capable of learning and can be taught tricks. You can teach them to recognize their name and sit up for food..." I have owned pet mice in the past and find this to be very accurate.

[voodoolamb]

But they DO have the capacity for emotions like stress and fear, dislike and like. Snakes can be smarter than they get credit for. They aren't pigs, chimps, or dolphins. But they are certainly more advanced than a mouse is.

More advanced than a mouse? Hardly.

I'd like to see your sources for that statement.

There has been countless studies on mice intelligence. They are very capable problem solvers and are capable of learning tasks. Other closely related species have proven to be megacognitive (rats) and even use tools (Degus). As highly social creatures they have a full emotional spectrum as well.

Snakes are no where even close.

[KingWheatley]

Yeah, it doesn't work on Tapatalk.

Thats a doofy feature... being able to like/thank something but not including a feature to remove it...

[BPGator]

There seems to be some confusion here with regards to the snake being stressed. A snake can be stressed due to improper environment to the point that it will refuse to eat because it does not feel secure. It can also be stressed temporarily while you are handling it, but will calm back down when returned to its enclosure. I seriously doubt your snake just can't wait to see you when you walk in the room and is so eager to be held by you. My BPs tolerate me. I'm pretty sure they're stressed out when I take them out - I can see their breathing increase and they try to slither away from me. They're not in total fear, or they'd probably stay balled up, but they want to find a place to hide. Your snake sounds healthy - it eats well, puts on weight and hides most of the day. But, when you take it out, it probably does get stressed, and may pass a bowel movement as a result.

I didn't realize PetSmart even sold feeders. If you want live, you're better off finding someone locally on Craigslist or a pet shop geared towards reptiles.


And as far as emotion goes:
noun 1. an affective state of consciousness in which joy, sorrow, fear, hate, or the like, is experienced, as distinguished from cognitive and volitional states of consciousness.
2.any of the feelings of joy, sorrow, fear, hate, love, etc.
3. any strong agitation of the feelings actuated by experiencing love, hate, fear, etc., and usually accompanied by certain physiological changes, as increased heartbeat or respiration, and often overt manifestation, as crying or shaking.

I suppose by this definition most animals have some level of emotion since they experience fear; it's a fundamental response for survival. Snakes do not love or hate. They do not feel sorrow or joy. These emotions would serve no purpose for a solitary animal like a ball python.

And lastly, chill out. People are just trying to help. If you disagree, then just disregard. If you're so reliant on what your vet says, why would you even ask the question here since you already know the answer and anything contradictory is wrong. Perhaps you'll realize one day that veterinarians and doctors don't always know what they're talking about. They have an extensive education, but use that to make an educated guess. They're not always right.

[KingWheatley]

More advanced than a mouse? Hardly.

I'd like to see your sources for that statement.

There has been countless studies on mice intelligence. They are very capable problem solvers and are capable of learning tasks. Other closely related species have proven to be megacognitive (rats) and even use tools (Degus). As highly social creatures they have a full emotional spectrum as well.

Snakes are no where even close.

I might be talking out my butt on this one then... I'm not sure to be honest where I got that from. Maybe my stepmom who is absolutely terrified of rodents... I knew Rats were smart.

well, I meant snakes aren't stupid. They're well developed for what they are meant for, but since they aren't domesticated...

Time for more reading.... Bugs can't be the only animal more stupid than a snake...

[Seven-Thirty]

Yea, no. Sorry, but you and seven-thirty are incorrect. He is not stressed out. he eats just fine and he is in good health per the vet. I'll trust his word as a professional over someone spouting what they THINK is correct. :3 Wheatley is perfectly fine, and to top it off you're wrong about snakes not having emotions. Fear and stress are both emotions.

You guys should really check out 1softkiss. But I bet you won't, because neither of you like being wrong.

I can't say a I blame you. What you do isn't wrong in of itself, but my little Wheatley is perfectly healthy, is a good weight, eats just fine, and does not show signs of stress. And this is all PER THE VET!

Oh boy. If you're willing to ignore advice, like in the numerous threads you've started, why do you keep asking them? You only respond to things you want to hear. For the record, fear and stress are responses to negative stimuli.


I do watch 1softkiss and enjoy her videos. I don't agree with some of the things she says but I do believe that a lot of the things she does with her snakes is a result of conditioning, not because a snake inherently doesn't want to mess up its enclosure. Not to mention a lot of the snakes that she takes outside are much older than yours and more accustomed to being handled, especially her ball pythons.

[KingWheatley]

There seems to be some confusion here with regards to the snake being stressed. A snake can be stressed due to improper environment to the point that it will refuse to eat because it does not feel secure. It can also be stressed temporarily while you are handling it, but will calm back down when returned to its enclosure. I seriously doubt your snake just can't wait to see you when you walk in the room and is so eager to be held by you. My BPs tolerate me. I'm pretty sure they're stressed out when I take them out - I can see their breathing increase and they try to slither away from me. They're not in total fear, or they'd probably stay balled up, but they want to find a place to hide. Your snake sounds healthy - it eats well, puts on weight and hides most of the day. But, when you take it out, it probably does get stressed, and may pass a bowel movement as a result.

I didn't realize PetSmart even sold feeders. If you want live, you're better off finding someone locally on Craigslist or a pet shop geared towards reptiles.


And as far as emotion goes:
noun 1. an affective state of consciousness in which joy, sorrow, fear, hate, or the like, is experienced, as distinguished from cognitive and volitional states of consciousness.
2.any of the feelings of joy, sorrow, fear, hate, love, etc.
3. any strong agitation of the feelings actuated by experiencing love, hate, fear, etc., and usually accompanied by certain physiological changes, as increased heartbeat or respiration, and often overt manifestation, as crying or shaking.

I suppose by this definition most animals have some level of emotion since they experience fear; it's a fundamental response for survival. Snakes do not love or hate. They do not feel sorrow or joy. These emotions would serve no purpose for a solitary animal like a ball python.

And lastly, chill out. People are just trying to help. If you disagree, then just disregard. If you're so reliant on what your vet says, why would you even ask the question here since you already know the answer and anything contradictory is wrong. Perhaps you'll realize one day that veterinarians and doctors don't always know what they're talking about. They have an extensive education, but use that to make an educated guess. They're not always right.

because the question I was asking didn't get answered until much later, and some users were offering unrelated answers, in my opinion.

i do NOT want live. O_O my ex had a BP when he was a kid he fed live and it traumatized the snake so much apparently it died. How true this is, I'm not sure, but it has me nervous enough to feed F/T.

also, 100% agree with you about the love/hate/sorrow/joy thing. I don't see BPs jumping up and such. Curious, perhaps. But certainly doesn't have preferences...

Temporary stress, huh? This makes a lot more sense to me as a possibility... hmm... I usually regard stress as a long term thing..

[KingWheatley]

Omg.... "reptile dysfunction."

Ok I'm laughing... That's actually funny.