Clean Bill of Health from Vet, but what about the popping sound?

[amozo]

So yesterday when I had my baby boy laying on under his hide on top of my belly, I could hear a very faint popping sound. From the research I have done, this seems to be an indication of the start of an RI. So I immediately panicked and made an appointment at my local VCA vet for all creatures. I saw a doctor that specializes in reptiles, but also sees cats, dogs birds, etc. He told me that my snake seemed very healthy and there was no mucus or discharge in any of his glands inside his mouth. I was sent home with a clean bill of health, which I am happy about.

My question is though, I am still worried about that faint popping sound. He doesn't make it at all if I am holding him or he is out and about. I only noticed it when he was in his hide for about 15 minutes. What shall I do to insure he doesn't catch an RI?

I have his cool side at 80-82 (it is pretty consistent, but I noticed the cool side drop as low as 76 at night), his warm side is anywhere from 88-92 and when I check with the temp gun, I get spots ranging from 81-95 depending on how deep down I bury the temp gun to the bottom of the tub under the substrate. Are these temps ok?

I went ahead and bumped up the heat to make sure on top of the substrate reaches the high eighties-low 90s. 95 is the hottest temperature I was able to find in his tub, so I hope that isn't too hot. It's weird, but the UTH from Zoomed that I have seems to not distribute the heat evenly all along the mat, it is more centralized, causing a small 95 degree hotspot (under substrate) with the surrounding area being at around 90.

I currently have a UTH on one side of the tub hooked up to a herpstat 1 and a space heater on the other side to warm up the ambient temps to around 80. I have a boaphile on the way for him complete with RHP and UTH because I like to keep my bedroom around 70 when I sleep and the snake room is hooked up to the same AC unit.

If anyone has any other better suggestions for his husbandry to insure he doesn't get sick I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks for reading!

[200xth]

I went ahead and bumped up the heat to make sure on top of the substrate reaches the high eighties-low 90s.

I, personally, would turn it down.

They can and will burrow. The hottest spot should be the bottom of the tub itself. If it's covered in substrate and they need it warmer, they will burrow to the heat on the tub floor. Just as an example, my tub floors are kept at 87 to 89, there's substrate on top of it, and they move things around in their tubs as they need to.

If your vet is good and is correct there is no RI, the popping noise could just be stuck shed around the nose area. I've had that happen before.

[Albert Clark]

So yesterday when I had my baby boy laying on under his hide on top of my belly, I could hear a very faint popping sound. From the research I have done, this seems to be an indication of the start of an RI. So I immediately panicked and made an appointment at my local VCA vet for all creatures. I saw a doctor that specializes in reptiles, but also sees cats, dogs birds, etc. He told me that my snake seemed very healthy and there was no mucus or discharge in any of his glands inside his mouth. I was sent home with a clean bill of health, which I am happy about.

My question is though, I am still worried about that faint popping sound. He doesn't make it at all if I am holding him or he is out and about. I only noticed it when he was in his hide for about 15 minutes. What shall I do to insure he doesn't catch an RI?

I have his cool side at 80-82 (it is pretty consistent, but I noticed the cool side drop as low as 76 at night), his warm side is anywhere from 88-92 and when I check with the temp gun, I get spots ranging from 81-95 depending on how deep down I bury the temp gun to the bottom of the tub under the substrate. Are these temps ok?

I went ahead and bumped up the heat to make sure on top of the substrate reaches the high eighties-low 90s. 95 is the hottest temperature I was able to find in his tub, so I hope that isn't too hot. It's weird, but the UTH from Zoomed that I have seems to not distribute the heat evenly all along the mat, it is more centralized, causing a small 95 degree hotspot (under substrate) with the surrounding area being at around 90.

I currently have a UTH on one side of the tub hooked up to a herpstat 1 and a space heater on the other side to warm up the ambient temps to around 80. I have a boaphile on the way for him complete with RHP and UTH because I like to keep my bedroom around 70 when I sleep and the snake room is hooked up to the same AC unit.

If anyone has any other better suggestions for his husbandry to insure he doesn't get sick I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks for reading!

Well, I would definitely bring it up to the vet that I am not satisfied that he is ok and why does he still have this popping sound! Tell him you think it may be a respiratory infection early stage and does he disagree! You are paying him for a service he should at least check a little more in depth to satisfy you. Keep us posted. Stay in peace and not in pieces.

[dr del]

as mentioned above is he in shed? The fluid between the skin layers reduces the size of the nostrils and unshed skin can do this also.

[Sauzo]

Yep could be shed or just your snake. Rosey my big BCI girl will actually breath heavily after I make her exercise around the couch or on the bed. Bumping up the temps is good but don't go above 95F for the hottest spot(that would mean under the aspen right on the tub). If your snake is eating and doing the snakey thing like usual, I probably wouldn't worry. If however you see any mucuous around the nose or mouth or your snake stargazes with its mouth open, then you need to either go back to that vet or go to a different one, whatever you feel comfortable with.

[amozo]

I don't believe he is in shed. I haven't had a shed with him yet and since he's a BEL I've heard their shed can go unnoticeable until just right before they shed. I did see a very small piece of skin stuck to his mouth though and got that off with some water. He hasn't made the sound again and seems to be acting normal and happy. Thanks for all the help! I will be keeping a close eye on him but the vet did say whatever the breeder did was great because he seems like a very healthy snake. I feel like it's hard to find good herp vets around though. This vet had never seen a white BP before.


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[MrLang]

Lessers have been known to have subtle deformities that can cause this. I would not have been surprised at all if this was a cinnamon either. For lessers in super form, they can have 'bug eyes' which is basically a compressed skull where the eyes will be pushed out and look larger than an average ball. This compression can also impact the nasal passages and make irregular sounds when they breathe. For cinnamons and super cinnamons, they have 'duck bill' which is a similar issue but further up on the snout - short/flat nose. This is much more common to cause breathing sounds (I've had 2 cinnamons that whistle subtley since birth). Shedding is another cause of this.

Just keep an eye on them. As long as you don't see any mucous around the nostrils or mouth and behavior doesn't change dramatically you don't have to worry.

[amozo]

Lessers have been known to have subtle deformities that can cause this. I would not have been surprised at all if this was a cinnamon either. For lessers in super form, they can have 'bug eyes' which is basically a compressed skull where the eyes will be pushed out and look larger than an average ball. This compression can also impact the nasal passages and make irregular sounds when they breathe. For cinnamons and super cinnamons, they have 'duck bill' which is a similar issue but further up on the snout - short/flat nose. This is much more common to cause breathing sounds (I've had 2 cinnamons that whistle subtley since birth). Shedding is another cause of this.

Just keep an eye on them. As long as you don't see any mucous around the nostrils or mouth and behavior doesn't change dramatically you don't have to worry.

But he is a super Russo form, no lesser or cinnamon in him. I did hear the popping/clicking sound again. He is eating fine and otherwise acting normal. It seems like the clicking starts after he has been out for more than a few minutes. Tonight, I am going to try and listen closely to his tub with him in his hide and see if he makes the sound in his home without being handled. He ate for me last night with enthusiasm.

Even though the vet said he is okay, I am still worried. The vet alluded to the fact that I am a paranoid mom. Am I? For Ares' sake I hope the vet is right about me being paranoid. I researched the vet's name and he has been called upon by our local "zoo" to attend to the animals there, so he must be good at exotic animals, right?

I just know that the popping is a tell tale sign of RI and this is my first BP. I want to insure that he lives a long and healthy life. I will be keeping an eye on him to check for any mucous or other signs of RI. I will take him back to a vet (maybe the same one, maybe a different one) if the clicking sound worsens or I see any other signs of illness.

[amozo]

I KNEW I should've listened to my instincts. My poor baby does indeed have an RI. I took him to a different vet about 1 week ago and he gave me 6 shots of Amikacin to clear it up. I figured out that I hadn't been keeping Ares warm enough. Although I have his mat on a Herpstat and it read 90-95 on the thermometer on the bottom of the tub, where Ares was sitting (paper towel and aspen) was only reaching 85 (measure with temp gun) and his cool side was 76-80 (50-65% humidity). So, living like that for 2 or so months is what I am assuming made him sick. I feel awful and like a terribly irresponsible owner. I am now having to experience the trauma of injecting the shots myself. It is so nerve wrecking and he gets so stressed out. I even made him bleed a little dot today (worried the needle went to far). I live alone and have no one nearby that will help me hold my snake down for the shots, so I just try my best to do it myself. I am making sure I hit muscle and have the needle at a 45* angle, but my god that is the worst thing I have had to do involving any pet I've had. It doesn't help that I have no experience with injecting needles of any kind, at least I have watched the doctor enough times to know I don't just stab straight down and go. I am also at a loss for the lack of snake care in my area and I live in a desert.

Anyways, he seems a tiny bit better. The vet I went to said his case isn't bad at all, but to me the open mouthed breathing and mucus bubbles seems pretty damn bad. Ares just had his third shot today. He is my sweetest snake (I have 3 total) and I would be absolutely devastated if anything bad happened to him. My other two snakes are cool, but this one is special.

I do not have another room to keep my other ball python in. I am making sure to not touch anything of his after I've touched Ares until I have a thorough scrub down or shower. I want to make sure the infection won't be spread through the air if they are in the same room. A towel that was used on Ares about 1 month ago was also used with my other BP. How long until symptoms show up from the RI? My other snakes seem fine. No popping or breathing sounds, but I am worried that towel might've spread it.

[D1C]

Glad you caught it. I lost a snake last week to an RI and I'll tell you, its nots something you want to see or experience.

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