"Less than seasoned" snake owners

[MontyAndMelissa]

Am I the only one that gets completely frustrated when people tell me the way I'm raising my 1.0 ball (he is my first ball), is the wrong way? He gets regular vet visits, where I am told he is always in excellent heath (minus when I very first got him, he had a few health issues from a previous owner) I feed him when he needs to be fed, I handle him when he needs to be handled, I make sure his temperatures and humidity are correct (and even keep a daily log) it really doesn't take a rocket scientist to keep a snake.

To all you new snake owners out there, there is a difference between people giving you a helpful critique to get you on the right track, and people just being plain rude because they have a herp collection and they've been collecting for X amount of years, and they know EVERYTHING there is to know about every snake ever.

It doesn't take rocket science to keep a snake, it does take some careful measuring of temperature to make sure your snake stays healthy, but its not a very hard thing to do if you have half a brain and the internet.

[HVani]

I hear ya. I run into this a lot of my reef forums. Some people just like to make things more complicated than it needs to be.

I've only been keeping snakes for 2 years and only been a reef kepper for 4 years. I will always be a n00b in some people's eyes because I don't have 20 years in either hobby. I just know what works for me. My animals are happy and healthy and that's all that matters.

[Eric Alan]

I completely understand your frustration. It can actually be applied to many different parts of life - not just snake keeping.

The one thing to keep in mind, though, is that you don't know what you don't know until someone says something. I think what you're getting at is that there's a big difference between experience and knowledge. Especially on an internet message board, the difference between the two can be difficult to discern. And, even when the difference is clear, a person still has to be willing to listen otherwise it doesn't matter what is said.

[MontyAndMelissa]

I completely understand your frustration. It can actually be applied to many different parts of life - not just snake keeping.

The one thing to keep in mind, though, is that you don't know what you don't know until someone says something. I think what you're getting at is that there's a big difference between experience and knowledge. Especially on an internet message board, the difference between the two can be difficult to discern. And, even when the difference is clear, a person still has to be willing to listen otherwise it doesn't matter what is said.

There is also a difference between critique and knowing everything (or thinking you do) I don't know everything about keeping snakes, never claimed to, but I know that the way I keep my ball seems to work fine.

[Stewart_Reptiles]

It doesn't take rocket science to keep a snake, it does take some careful measuring of temperature to make sure your snake stays healthy, but its not a very hard thing to do if you have half a brain and the internet.

Obviously if it was that easy for everybody you wouldn't see the same questions years after years

Help my snake doesn't eat
Help my snake does not poop
Help my snake strikes at me
Help my snake has a burn
Help my snake has scale rot
Help my snake has a RI

[Eric Alan]

There is also a difference between critique and knowing everything (or thinking you do) I don't know everything about keeping snakes, never claimed to, but I know that the way I keep my ball seems to work fine.

Again, I agree with your premise. I really do. A phrase that honestly makes me nauseous, though, is anyone saying "we've always done it this way and it works for us". To me it says they're either too ignorant to think of ways to improve, or too lazy to try. "We've always done it this way" is never EVER a good reason to keep doing something.

[MontyAndMelissa]

Again, I agree with your premise. I really do. A phrase that honestly makes me nauseous, though, is anyone saying "we've always done it this way and it works for us". To me it says they're either too ignorant to think of ways to improve, or too lazy to try. "We've always done it this way" is never EVER a good reason to keep doing something.

I'm always open to critique, if it will actually help the situation. I will not, however, change the way my snakes tank looks because its "more aesthetically pleasing" or "the $50 substrate works better than the $20", when in reality its exactly the same thing. My point is that just because a person has owned snakes longer, or more of them, is no reason to ve rude. I used to have a red tail boa we got when she was a hatchling, and she grew to be 7 ft, perfectly healthy her whole life. They didn't have forums back then, though. Lol.

[MontyAndMelissa]

New snake owners are already nervous that they're doing it wrong, any pet owner is that way, so when giving advice, give it in a friendly manner. I just read a post asking if snakes are ticklish, and instead of giving actual answers, people were just smartasses.

[Lizardlicks]

New snake owners are already nervous that they're doing it wrong, any pet owner is that way, so when giving advice, give it in a friendly manner. I just read a post asking if snakes are ticklish, and instead of giving actual answers, people were just smartasses.

I think where the conflict is coming here is not clashes in husbandry methods, but new snakes owners, who've never owned a reptile before, reacting to things their snakes do as if it were a mammal, with the same kind of emotional response as higher brained animals. They are not mammals though, and I think the more seasoned keepers are just generally, gently amused by newbies' rampant propensity toward anthropomorphizing. Snakes do not have the emotion processing centers in their brains that most mammals and even some other reptiles do. That isn't to say that the animals don't express themselves at all, whether they are comfortable and relatively stress free in their environment, but learning those cues when you're used to how, say, a dog or cat would deliver them, can be an on going process. For an example: something like, "Oh, he's so curious, he loves to explore!" could actually mean for a snake that likes to stay still and hidden, like a BP, that there is something in its environment that is causing it discomfort, and it's looking for a means to get away from what ever that is.

Doing a little research and learning about the animals behavior in the wild can go a long way to deciphering what its captive behavior is actually trying to tell you, but it's still a trial and error process. New owners just need time and patience. In the mean time, reading things like "he loves me, so he gives me kisses!" is still going to be funny.

[MontyAndMelissa]

I think where the conflict is coming here is not clashes in husbandry methods, but new snakes owners, who've never owned a reptile before, reacting to things their snakes do as if it were a mammal, with the same kind of emotional response as higher brained animals. They are not mammals though, and I think the more seasoned keepers are just generally, gently amused by newbies' rampant propensity toward anthropomorphizing. Snakes do not have the emotion processing centers in their brains that most mammals and even some other reptiles do. That isn't to say that the animals don't express themselves at all, whether they are comfortable and relatively stress free in their environment, but learning those cues when you're used to how, say, a dog or cat would deliver them, can be an on going process. For an example: something like, "Oh, he's so curious, he loves to explore!" could actually mean for a snake that likes to stay still and hidden, like a BP, that there is something in its environment that is causing it discomfort, and it's looking for a means to get away from what ever that is.

Doing a little research and learning about the animals behavior in the wild can go a long way to deciphering what its captive behavior is actually trying to tell you, but it's still a trial and error process. New owners just need time and patience. In the mean time, reading things like "he loves me, so he gives me kisses!" is still going to be funny.

Most snakes (that I've seen at least) won't venture near their owners face, unless they are slithering behind their neck for warmth. I know that when Monty is stressed out, he won't come near me, he will intentionally avoid me, even while I'm holding him. He will try to get away. If he is relaxed, he will slither behind my neck, and push his face against mine. (Cheek to cheek) and I know he is stress free. Monty is also usually face shy, but I know he's comfortable with me because I am the only one who can safely remove him from his tank and touch his head. Some things can be explained scientifically. But I also get the feeling that many of the "seasoned" snake owners here have done hours of research, own a few snakes, and think they know everything. What did people do when they owned snakes BEFORE there was the internet, or even books about snakes? They winged it. Just because you can type "ball python" into the google search engine, and click on a few links, doesn't mean you know everything about snakes. I went to school for 3 years for veterinary with an emphasis on herpetology, and an additional 2 for an emphasis on equine health. I don't know everything there is to know about animals, but when people ask for advice, I give them my personal opinion. Not a smart ass answer that just makes them feel stupid.