Effects of food quality...Watch your Protein

[purple python]

I have tried 3 different brands of food with my small colony, and have seen noticeable effects with each change in diet.

When I first started out, I was feeding my 1:3 breeders Kaytee Forti-Diet Pro Health, which I picked up at my local pet store. On this brand, I was loosing pups left and right, the rats had an unpleasant smell, and bad allergies for some of them.

After a lot of reading, I switched my colony to Mazuri Rodent Diet (not 6f version) and had greater improvement in rat size, growth, and pup health. My rats never sneezed and seemed to really prefer this brand. However after a few weeks, my favorite little rat mama - a hooded american blue began "rusting", and it continued to spread up her back till she was almost completely tan. The rats didn't smell any better, but it was a different odor now.


After more reading, I concluded Mazuri Rodent Diet was far to high in protein and I could see the effects of it in my weaned pups. An adult, non-breeding rat will do well on 14-16% protein diet. The Mazuri I was using was 23% (Harlan also makes a 24% protein lab block). Breeding females and growing pups need a little more protein than non-breeding adults, but in my opinion, lower protein = healthier rats.

I decided to try Harlan 2018 (18% protein) which is formulated for breeding rats and young and conveniently available at my local feed store. I like this brand because of the ingredients - no animal product, ground wheat/corn vs Mazuri's dehulled soybean. I supplement with mealworms, veggies, egg and dog treats (Fruitables). Since making the switch I have noticed less smell than Mazuri, still plump healthy pups/no losses, no sneezing, and the rats can't seem to get enough of it.

My favorite rat mama is changing back to the deep gray that I love so much, the rusting effect is nearly gone, and all of my rats are noticeably more shiny.


I'm not saying Mazuri is a lesser brand - I'm actually curious about trying the 6F version (16% protein) and interested in what you may have noticed with your rats and what brand of rodent food is giving you the best results...

[Rhasputin]

Yikes! to me 20% + seems really high for an every day diet! I try to stay around 16%, so 18% sounds reasonable. I Maybe the 20% + would be good to specifically feed to preggo ladies and pups, but I would definitely switch back and forth when they're off duty.

I just supliment the 16-18% food with seeds and beef suet bird treats for my ladies when they're on the job.
Interesting mini study!

[MrLang]

Thanks for sharing. This conversation comes up a lot here and on other forums and Facebook groups. I used Mazuri 6F for a while and it worked well, but it was hard to get ahold of and overall lackluster. I now feed Doggy Bag brand Dog Food after finding it on a number of fancy rat breeder forums and after talking with a fancy rat breeder in my area who has been using it as a preferred feed for several years:

http://www.tractorsupply.com/webapp/...=&cm_vc=-10005

If you check out the ingredients and stats, it's right in line: 18% protein, Wheat and Corn, yes it has animal product in it but I haven't had problems with greasiness or cannibalism from it. For $15 for 40 lbs, I feel it's the best choice in terms of balancing cost with quality (for a RAT, NOT a dog!!!)

[KING JAMES]

Nice little report on the foods.
I have thought about looking into some new foods but I cant find anything that beats the price of what I am using now.
http://kentfeeds.com/products/other-...dent-products/
I use the 19% stuff and have never had any issues, that and it only cost me $16.39 for a 50lb bag (Or $147.51 for 500lbs)

[Rhasputin]

MRLang, for $15 you can also get 40-50lb hog food from most places. In my opinion it is a better chow for mice and rats. One big thing I don't approve of in doggy bag is the use of 'animal' products, and 'animal' bone. It does not specify what sort of animal is in there, or what sort of products are in it, so I steer away. It also feels greasy to me, because they spray the pellets with artificial and natural flavors to make dogs want to eat it (poor dogs!). The hog food doesn't have this, because i guess pigs don't care what their pellets smell like!
It also contains BHA which is a suspected cancer causing agent, and menandione, which has been linked to liver problems.


It's a personal choice, but these are my opinions on the two feeds.

King James, it looks like kent makes a 23% rodent food as well. Makes me wonder... Someone, somewhere out there is clearly having success with high protein, and there is a demand for it. But everyone I've ever spoken to that's put any thought into it, seems clearly opposed to using such a high protein level.

[KING JAMES]

I have thought about using it in my maternity tubs..but never made the jump. I think when used correctly and sparingly it might be handy...but never as a standard food.

[Lady mkrj58]

Good Thread I am going to start a rat breeding program Thanks for the info.

Lady M

[purple python]

It would be interesting to compare how well breeding rats do with a higher protein diet vs breeders on a low protein diet. In my experience with litters raised on Mazuri, the pups did well and grew fast. However, after being weaned onto food, they became bloated/fat. This was not megacolon because within days of switching to the lower protein Harlan, the small rats slimmed right down to a healthy size.

Perhaps to some extent the higher protein diets are for bulking up rats - I can't imaging a breeding female rat really needs +23% protein when she can thrive on 14-16% when she isn't carrying. Just seems like too big of a jump in percentages to me.

I also looked into feeding my rats a dog food and came across Natural Balance Vegetarian Formula (http://www.petco.com/product/10962/N...-Dog-Food.aspx) It's got an awesome ingredient list and protein at 18%.. I might invest in a 5 lb bag and feed it to one of my breeding groups for the sake of my curiosity.

My rats were healthy on a high protein diet, but they are doing even better on a lower one - which makes me curious about trying Mazuri 6F because of just 16% protein and yet I have read some great reviews about it.

But I think what's most important - no matter what type of food you feed, is the ingredients. Ground wheat/corn/soybean is only so good, which is why I offer fresh veggies, mealworms, and a vegetarian dog treat (fruitables) on different days of the week.

[BHReptiles]

I use Mazuri 6F for my rodents. I don't have a huge colony yet so my numbers of comparison are pretty small, but I feed this to all my rats. For my pregnant and nursing moms, I also supplement with Pedigree Large Breed dog food for some supplemental protein. The others do not receive the dog food. Once I wean my babies, they no longer receive the dog food either. My females stay of good body weight after they delivery and pups grow large and fast. Out of five litters that I've had born, I've lost no pups after delivery. My holdback rats are also growing nicely and don't appear to be obese or have any health problems.

[Rhasputin]

Purple python, you might try offering seeds and oats and whole grain cheerios as treats rather than fruits and veggies. Rats and mice rarely eat fruits and vegetables naturally, and most can have minor negative effects (bloating, diarrhea) on their digestive systems (few can have very bad effects, but none are especially good for rats and mice).

Whole grain cheerios (the sugar free kind) are a real big hit with most rodents!
I would also recomend not using a vegetarian dog treat, but going with a natural freeze dried chicken kind instead (if you're looking for something natural). The meat is healthy for them, and they really like them.
The mealworms are definitely good for them! Crickets are fun too, it's great to see the rodents turn into wild animals and chase crickets around!