Vote for BP.Net for the 2013 Forum of the Year! Click here for more info.

» Site Navigation

» Home
 > FAQ

» Online Users: 962

0 members and 962 guests
No Members online
Most users ever online was 47,180, 07-16-2025 at 05:30 PM.

» Today's Birthdays

None

» Stats

Members: 75,937
Threads: 249,130
Posts: 2,572,295
Top Poster: JLC (31,651)
Welcome to our newest member, GeorgiaD182
Results 1 to 7 of 7
  1. #1
    BPnet Senior Member Bluebonnet Herp's Avatar
    Join Date
    05-28-2012
    Location
    Helotes, TX
    Posts
    1,161
    Thanks
    1,405
    Thanked 476 Times in 316 Posts

    Coldblooded Does Not Mean Stupid

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/19/sc...upid.html?_r=0

    The article was from Nov. last year, but I somehow missed it up to this point. Better now than never I guess.

    Quote Originally Posted by New York Times
    Humans have no exclusive claim on intelligence. Across the animal kingdom, all sorts of creatures have performed impressive intellectual feats. A bonobo named Kanzi uses an array of symbols to communicate with humans. Chaser the border collie knows the English words for more than 1,000 objects. Crows make sophisticated tools, elephants recognize themselves in the mirror, and dolphins have a rudimentary number sense.

    Anolis evermanni lizards normally attack their prey from above. The lizards were challenged to find a way to access insects that were kept inside a small hole covered with a tightfitting blue cap.

    And reptiles? Well, at least they have their looks.

    In the plethora of research over the past few decades on the cognitive capabilities of various species, lizards, turtles and snakes have been left in the back of the class. Few scientists bothered to peer into the reptile mind, and those who did were largely unimpressed.

    “Reptiles don’t really have great press,” said Gordon M. Burghardt, a comparative psychologist at the University of Tennessee at Knoxville. “Certainly in the past, people didn’t really think too much of their intelligence. They were thought of as instinct machines.” But now that is beginning to change, thanks to a growing interest in “coldblooded cognition” and recent studies revealing that reptile brains are not as primitive as we imagined. The research could not only redeem reptiles but also shed new light on cognitive evolution.

    Because reptiles, birds and mammals diverged so long ago, with a common ancestor that lived 280 million years ago, the emerging data suggest that certain sophisticated mental skills may be more ancient than had been assumed — or so adaptive that they evolved multiple times.

    For evidence of reptilian intelligence, one need look no further than the maze, a time-honored laboratory test. Anna Wilkinson, a comparative psychologist at the University of Lincoln in England, tested a female red-footed tortoise named Moses in the radial arm maze, which has eight spokes radiating out from a central platform. Moses’ task was to “solve” the maze as efficiently as possible: to snatch a piece of strawberry from the end of each arm without returning to one she had already visited.

    “That requires quite a memory load because you have to remember where you’ve been,” Dr. Wilkinson said.

    Moses managed admirably, performing significantly better than if she had been choosing arms at random. Further investigation revealed that she was not using smell to find the treats. Instead, she seemed to be using external landmarks to navigate, just as mammals do.

    Things became even more interesting when Dr. Wilkinson hung a black curtain around the maze, depriving Moses of the rich environmental cues that had surrounded her. The tortoise adopted a new navigational strategy, exploring the maze systematically by entering whatever arm was directly adjacent to the one she had just left. This approach is “an enormously great” way of solving the task, Dr. Wilkinson said, and a strategy rarely seen in mammals.

    Navigational skills are important, but the research also hints at something even more impressive: behavioral flexibility, or the ability to alter one’s behavior as external circumstances change. This flexibility, which allows animals to take advantage of new environments or food sources, has been well documented in birds and primates, and scientists are now beginning to believe that it exists in reptiles, too.

    Anole, a tropical lizard, have a very specific method of acquiring food, striking at moving prey from above. But Manuel S. Leal, a biologist at Duke University, created a situation in which this strategy simply would not work, hiding a tasty insect larva inside a small hole and covering the hole with a tightfitting blue cap.

    Two of the six lizards he tested tried to extract the treat by attacking the blue disk from above, to no avail. But the other four puzzled out new approaches. Two lizards came at the disk sideways, using their mouths to bite and lift it, while the others used their snouts as levers to pry it off the baited well.

    Then Dr. Leal increased the difficulty by hiding the larvae under a new cap, this one blue and yellow. He used the solid blue disk to cover an adjacent, empty well. In tests of four lizards, two recognized the switch and learned that getting the bait now required flipping the multicolored disk instead of the blue one.

    Other studies have documented similar levels of flexibility and problem solving. Dr. Burghardt, for instance, presented monitor lizards with an utterly unfamiliar apparatus, a clear plastic tube with two hinged doors and several live mice inside. The lizards rapidly figured out how to rotate the tube and open the doors to capture the prey. “It really amazed us that they all solved the problem very quickly and then did much better the second time,” Dr. Burghardt said. “That’s a sign of real learning.”

    So how did we miss this for so long? Scientists say that many early studies of reptile cognition, conducted in the 1950s and ’60s, had critical design flaws.

    By using experiments originally designed for mammals, researchers may have been setting reptiles up for failure. For instance, scientists commonly use “aversive stimuli,” such as loud sounds and bright lights, to shape rodent behavior. But reptiles respond to many of these stimuli by freezing, thereby not performing.

    Scientists may also have been asking reptiles to perform impossible tasks. Lizards do not use their legs to manipulate objects, Dr. Leal said, “so you cannot develop an experiment where you’re expecting them to unwrap a box, for example.”

    What’s more, because they are coldblooded, reptiles are particularly sensitive to environmental conditions. Rats and mice can run a maze just fine in a 70-degree lab, but many reptilian species need a much warmer environment — with air temperatures in the mid-80s or 90s. “They seem to learn the quickest at body temperatures that are very uncomfortable for us,” Dr. Burghardt said.

    Now that scientists have gotten better at designing experiments for reptiles, they are uncovering all kinds of surprising abilities. Some of the most intriguing work involves social learning. The conventional wisdom is that because reptiles are largely solitary, asocial creatures, they are incapable of learning through observation.

    New research calls that assumption into question. In another study of red-footed tortoises, Dr. Wilkinson deposited a tortoise on one side of a wire fence and a piece of strawberry on the other, in sight but just out of reach. To get their snouts on the treat, the tortoises needed to take a long detour around the edge of the fence.

    Not one tortoise figured this out on its own. (Unable to reach the reward, some of the animals simply decided to nap.) But when they watched a trained tortoise navigate around the fence, all the observers learned to follow suit.

    Other studies of reptiles have turned up similar results, challenging the popular theory that social learning evolved as a byproduct of — and a special adaptation for — group living. Instead, Dr. Wilkinson said, social learning may be merely an outgrowth of an animal’s general ability to learn.

    The field of reptile cognition is in its infancy, but it already suggests that “intelligence” may be more widely distributed through the animal kingdom than had been imagined. As Dr. Burghardt put it, “People are starting to take some of the tests that were developed for the ‘smart’ animals and adapting them to use with other species, and finding that the ‘smart’ animals may not be so special.”

  2. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Bluebonnet Herp For This Useful Post:

    AlexisFitzy (03-04-2014),Flikky (03-04-2014),Marrissa (03-04-2014)

  3. #2
    Registered User Craigaria's Avatar
    Join Date
    12-28-2013
    Location
    Monroe, GA
    Posts
    257
    Thanks
    39
    Thanked 88 Times in 59 Posts

    Re: Coldblooded Does Not Mean Stupid

    Now the real question is, "Does my snake love me?"
    1.0 lesser yellowbelly
    1.0 banana
    1.0 black pastel
    0.1 lesserbee (Alice)
    1.0 firefly (cranky Frankie)
    0.1 fire (Dottie)
    0.1 het clown
    1.0 double het pied/clown (Stryker)
    1.0 bearded dragon (Ziggy)
    0.1 sulcata (Ellie)
    1.0 mini schnauzer (Bailey)
    1.0 b rainbow boa (Trip)

  4. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Craigaria For This Useful Post:

    AlexisFitzy (03-04-2014),Slim (03-04-2014)

  5. #3
    BPnet Senior Member Slim's Avatar
    Join Date
    11-17-2008
    Location
    Gainesville, FL
    Posts
    7,739
    Thanks
    3,258
    Thanked 4,252 Times in 2,630 Posts
    Images: 1
    I'm very glad to see that science wants to look closer at reptile intelligence, and I will look forward to reading their studies. Of course none of it will change the fact that a Ball Python's brain is about the size of a black eyed pea, nor will it change previous findings about body weight to brain size ratios and their relationship to intelligence.
    Thomas "Slim" Whitman
    Never Met A Ball Python I Didn't Like

  6. #4
    Registered User cheaversg's Avatar
    Join Date
    01-22-2014
    Posts
    79
    Thanks
    12
    Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
    I been had the opinion that my snake loves me ahaha of course its not fact but heres my case:

    My snake recognizes smell.
    When i put my snake on someone else it doesn't move it balls up.
    My snake therefore associates my smell with safety.
    So therefore it recognizes my smell
    So it must recognize me.
    And if my snake can recognize me.
    Then can it not associate me with experiences it has when im around.
    The only way to test this is to make someone smell like me and hold my snake hahaha

    I think its very easy to prove a snake knows its owner.
    To just say:
    "Its tame."
    "It doesn't know anything."
    "All it knows is safety and food."
    Is basically giving the reptile mind to the mind of an insect and I know the my Bp is smarter than a worm.

    When it rains earthworms come up out of the dirt because its easier for them to move (has to do with moisture and oxygen and not drying out to long to explain youll get the point) but the insect mind has them moving across concrete getting swooped up by birds during the day and when it stops raining they dont make it back to the soil because they wandered to far off and they dry up.

    A snake knows whats safe and whats not, when its safe drink when its not, who would or wouldnt be safe if someone abused it.
    So how can anyone argue or ignore or not even give a thought that hey your bp may know you.

    Im happy I read this article and I definitely will be watching this develop because im pretty sure my snake knows me.

  7. #5
    BPnet Veteran
    Join Date
    02-01-2014
    Posts
    225
    Thanks
    22
    Thanked 96 Times in 73 Posts

    Re: Coldblooded Does Not Mean Stupid

    I love the experiment with the tortoise and the strawberries.

    NEVER underestimate a tortoise when strawberries are on the line!

    Sent from my SM-G730V using Tapatalk 2

  8. #6
    BPnet Senior Member Bluebonnet Herp's Avatar
    Join Date
    05-28-2012
    Location
    Helotes, TX
    Posts
    1,161
    Thanks
    1,405
    Thanked 476 Times in 316 Posts

    Re: Coldblooded Does Not Mean Stupid

    Quote Originally Posted by Craigaria View Post
    Now the real question is, "Does my snake love me?"
    Oh yeah, definitely. That's why my snake licks my face and wags her tail every time she sees me.
    Last edited by Bluebonnet Herp; 03-04-2014 at 10:18 PM.

  9. #7
    BPnet Veteran Mr Oni's Avatar
    Join Date
    01-04-2013
    Location
    Upstate NY
    Posts
    634
    Thanks
    352
    Thanked 258 Times in 192 Posts

    Re: Coldblooded Does Not Mean Stupid

    I really have nothing to offer.
    Cool read though.
    Balls
    1.0 Bumblebee Het Ghost
    1.0 Power ball
    0.1 Fire Ghost
    0.1 Butter Pin
    Milks
    1.0 Eastern milk snake
    0.1 Extreme Hypo Honduran
    Hognose
    0.1 Western hognose Albino
    Leopard Gecko
    1.0 Sunglow


    Beware his song about big butts. He beats you up while he ppppllllaaaaysss iiiit-- Eyugh!

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to Mr Oni For This Useful Post:

    Flikky (03-04-2014)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.2.1