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  1. #41
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    Re: How to keep retics on the smaller side? (Mainlands)

    Quote Originally Posted by jclaiborne View Post
    I will also add his "store" charges a 5 dollar admission to visit the "zoo" where you can observe "proper husbandry and care for exotic animals...so if joe shmo walks in with his kids and sees that its "ok" to house these animals like this because this is a how a reputable breeder is housing them...the another animal suffers amd more bad light gets shined on our hobby and community...the employees also gave advice like "burmese pythons and retics make great beginner pets as long as you get them as babies" that's terrible advice to give to someone...I know I am in now way capable of working with and caring for these large animals...but someone that doesn't know better is why these animals end up on craigslist.

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    Lol.

    75% of this hobby gives a bad light, you think this is special. Maybe PP has some bad hourly workers. I know and I talk to Jay and Tim for my questions, no one else, I don't use the front desk if I have a question- they have always taken great care of me, given great advice, and always seem to be very knowledgeable.

    Burms and retics are not bad beginner pets, they aren't for the feint of heart, but as I've told multiple people- I trust my retics more than I trust your average shelter dog (a typical first pet), if you know what you're doing, and do it right, with the right advice, a retic is a fantastic pet animal.

  2. #42
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    Re: How to keep retics on the smaller side? (Mainlands)

    Quote Originally Posted by jclaiborne View Post
    Again you keeps saying their breeding facility...which is not their store front...I can tell you for a fact their store front is terrible...sure I'm some random guy you don't know but a quick search of the BOI and multiple reviews from herp sites running a google search shows everyone saying the same thing as I am...I am not claiming to be a retic expert I am just making people aware of the fact thst just because someome can produce beautiful animals doesn't mean they care for them properly...and to me that is not ok no animal should be mistreated.

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    I deal with the breeding facility.

    Most people who order a retic from them online, get them from the same facility.

    The reptile zoo/PP storefront are 2 very different things. I've never been in the storefront, nor plan to, never talked to hourly employees etc.

    I base all my information based on their retic breeding facility, which is overseen and ran by Jay and Tim, and they do a great job.

  3. #43
    BPnet Senior Member jclaiborne's Avatar
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    Re: How to keep retics on the smaller side? (Mainlands)

    I'm not debating a retic is a fantastic animal I have great respect for these animals...all animals...but I respectfully have to disagree that telling someone that has never worked with a snake larger than a bp with a 5 year old son makes a great first pet

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    SNAKES
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  4. #44
    BPnet Senior Member jclaiborne's Avatar
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    Re: How to keep retics on the smaller side? (Mainlands)

    You are missing my point...how many people that are looking for a first time reptile know to contact the breeding facility...their breeding facility may be great it may be top notch...but if they can't take care of the animals in their store front and they get neglected then he needs to be more hands on eith his store.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk
    SNAKES
    1.0 Childrens Python
    LIZARDS
    0.1 B&W Tegu, 1.0 Bearded Dragon, 1.1 IJ Blue Tongue Skinks
    FROGS
    0.0.5 Dendrobates tinctorius 'Citronella'
    DOGS
    1.0 German Sherherd (Timber), 1.0 Wolf/Shepherd (Sabre), 1.0 Chihuahua (Taz), 0.1 Chihuahua (Penny), 0.1 Pitbull (Luna)

  5. #45
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    Re: How to keep retics on the smaller side? (Mainlands)

    Quote Originally Posted by jclaiborne View Post
    I'm not debating a retic is a fantastic animal I have great respect for these animals...all animals...but I respectfully have to disagree that telling someone that has never worked with a snake larger than a bp with a 5 year old son makes a great first pet

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk
    So we went from a beginner pet, to suddenly a beginner pet for a 5 year old?

    2 COMPLETELY different things. For me, as a 23 year old adult, a retic would be a suitable first time pet. For a 5 year old? A hamster is about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by jclaiborne View Post
    You are missing my point...how many people that are looking for a first time reptile know to contact the breeding facility...their breeding facility may be great it may be top notch...but if they can't take care of the animals in their store front and they get neglected then he needs to be more hands on eith his store.

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    Most of the people who want to buy a retic from them don't use the storefront. They use fauna, kingsnake etc.

    The OP was asking for advice on retics. I backed advice given from Jay Brewer at PP, who has tremendous retic experience. The condition of their storefront is irrelevant to the OPs question.

  6. #46
    BPnet Senior Member jclaiborne's Avatar
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    Re: How to keep retics on the smaller side? (Mainlands)

    First of all no not for a 5 year old...but I have a 5 year old in my house...who loves reptiles and is hands on with what we have...and the employees are saying oh its great for your family...I am done trying to prove my point...I have seen first hand how they care for their animals and I choose to not support someone that neglects animals because they aren't their main money maker. But you are right and I am wrong... I am off topic at this point. Have a nice night. Good luck OP who if I am correct isn't even 18 yet.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk
    SNAKES
    1.0 Childrens Python
    LIZARDS
    0.1 B&W Tegu, 1.0 Bearded Dragon, 1.1 IJ Blue Tongue Skinks
    FROGS
    0.0.5 Dendrobates tinctorius 'Citronella'
    DOGS
    1.0 German Sherherd (Timber), 1.0 Wolf/Shepherd (Sabre), 1.0 Chihuahua (Taz), 0.1 Chihuahua (Penny), 0.1 Pitbull (Luna)

  7. #47
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    I have a 6 week old child in my house.

    I do presentations with my large snakes with young children- because it's part of what got me started in the area I am now.

    If done properly, with proper locks on the cage- why is a 5 year old a problem?

  8. #48
    BPnet Senior Member jclaiborne's Avatar
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    Re: How to keep retics on the smaller side? (Mainlands)

    I have no problems with educational programs and my son loves those programs. However keeping one at home, especially if I have never owned one before or anything larger than a BP and am learning about them, at some point I (as an owner) may make a mistake or the snake may decide to strike and if that happens, I as a parent don't want to have to worry about myself, the snake, and my son in the same room. I believe a large snake needs to be worked up to...I also feel that a full grown yellow anaconda can be a hand full (personal opinion not fact) and for that reason because accident can and do happen I don't believe it is a suitable first snake.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk
    SNAKES
    1.0 Childrens Python
    LIZARDS
    0.1 B&W Tegu, 1.0 Bearded Dragon, 1.1 IJ Blue Tongue Skinks
    FROGS
    0.0.5 Dendrobates tinctorius 'Citronella'
    DOGS
    1.0 German Sherherd (Timber), 1.0 Wolf/Shepherd (Sabre), 1.0 Chihuahua (Taz), 0.1 Chihuahua (Penny), 0.1 Pitbull (Luna)

  9. #49
    BPnet Lifer reptileexperts's Avatar
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    Re: How to keep retics on the smaller side? (Mainlands)

    Quote Originally Posted by Dehlol View Post
    I will add- I'm being bashed by people that have 1-2 retics, both young (whoopy), someone with NO retics, and someone with 10, none of which are large animals (I've seen you post pictures plenty of times).

    I would hardly take any of these guy's opinion and put any merit on them OP.
    I'm not going to bother reading your post from here on out. Don't take offense - but show me a little respect and perhaps you can get some in return. Please explain to me your knowledge of the species and growth rates based on evolution biology? Do you have a degree to back up your call outs of misinformation? I'm not going to throw my degrees at you, nor the fact that I'm more read and versed in this stuff than most. Yeah I know about Gaspers 16' pure Jamp female, I also know of Bob clarks 12' 50% SD crosses, even the 14' ones. Get a pure SD and it's a different story. You've seen my post and pictures? great. I do keep small because I work with dwarf and super dwarf retics and crosses. My largest is currently 13', and 3 others are 10', regardless of what your mission is here acting as Jay's little fan boy, take it else where.

    I will not argue that retics can not be healthy being on the smaller side, but they are not evolved to be that way. They are evolved on the mainland (which is still an island mind you) to be top predators and reach good size. Yeah, I've read numerous scientific papers on growth studies, diet, and retics vs the locals. I've put my mind where my mouth is and studied this stuff because it is something that drives my actual passion for this hobby. Sorry, is 10 not enough? It is for me. . . I have more to life than sitting around cleaning urine all day which is pretty much what I do when I'm home with the 10 I have.

    Now please, if you feel the need to insult me, go right ahead. But don't expect me to take into consideration anything you have to say in regards to this matter.
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    "...That which we do not understand, we fear. That which we fear, we destroy. Thus eliminating the fear" ~Explains every killed snake"

  10. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to reptileexperts For This Useful Post:

    Himitsu (02-13-2014),jclaiborne (02-13-2014)

  11. #50
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    Re: How to keep retics on the smaller side? (Mainlands)

    Quote Originally Posted by reptileexperts View Post
    I'm not going to bother reading your post from here on out. Don't take offense - but show me a little respect and perhaps you can get some in return. Please explain to me your knowledge of the species and growth rates based on evolution biology? Do you have a degree to back up your call outs of misinformation? I'm not going to throw my degrees at you, nor the fact that I'm more read and versed in this stuff than most. Yeah I know about Gaspers 16' pure Jamp female, I also know of Bob clarks 12' 50% SD crosses, even the 14' ones. Get a pure SD and it's a different story. You've seen my post and pictures? great. I do keep small because I work with dwarf and super dwarf retics and crosses. My largest is currently 13', and 3 others are 10', regardless of what your mission is here acting as Jay's little fan boy, take it else where.
    Why would I show you any respect, when you come in and show one of the biggest names in the industry no respect- based on your VAST knowledge of owning a small handful of tiny retics that are SD/D crosses, yet you somehow think you are in any league to argue with some of the biggest names in the business.

    Based on what? Owning a few animals and doing some google reading? In that case I could be a tractor expert!

    Pure SD can get some decent size if you feed it heavy enough, so can crosses, so can XYZ. That doesn't mean it should, that doesn't mean it should be fed like it should.

    Tell me, do you honestly think a retic in the wild eats similar to the animals we keep in captivity? Are you that Naive? Have you ever seen pictures straight out of the skinning factories, of animals caught IN THE WILD? Smaller retics turn up often, in the 10-14' range, this seems about average for a mature adult in the wild. Will they eventually grow much larger, sure, is it common? nope, huge retics are a rarity in the wild, and they need a lot of factors lining up to grow to a monster size- one that is EASILY achievable in a captive setting.

    I will not argue that retics can not be healthy being on the smaller side, but they are not evolved to be that way. They are evolved on the mainland (which is still an island mind you) to be top predators and reach good size. Yeah, I've read numerous scientific papers on growth studies, diet, and retics vs the locals. I've put my mind where my mouth is and studied this stuff because it is something that drives my actual passion for this hobby. Sorry, is 10 not enough? It is for me. . . I have more to life than sitting around cleaning urine all day which is pretty much what I do when I'm home with the 10 I have.

    Now please, if you feel the need to insult me, go right ahead. But don't expect me to take into consideration anything you have to say in regards to this matter.
    I insult you because you know nothing, you admit- your animals are not mainland animals, but here you are speaking on mainland animals. Here you are claiming knowledge of an animal you don't have vast experience in- because... "you've read some papers etc"

    Yet somehow you feel you know more than someone who has based his living and his life raising mainland retics on a large scale, who has an impressive collection, someone who knows his stuff pretty darn well.

    A mainland female if you want it big can hit 18-20ft, a mainland male, if you feed heavy enough- an average of 14-16ft for a massive male. Of course, sometimes animals are the exception to this and get larger, but it certainly is not commonplace.

    A mainland female, if you feed it on average 14-16ft, a male, 10-14ft.

    A mainland female, if you want to keep it manageable: 12-14ft, males 8-10ft, and there is NOTHING wrong with them being this size, frankly from all the animals pulled from the wild I've seen, and pictures directly from the field, this seems about average for an adult retic- and it's pretty common practice to keep males that size anyway.

    I'm not advocating you starve the animal to keep it tiny, but you certainly don't have to shoot for an massive snake just because it's a retic.

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