A couple of questions (with pictures)

[TacoTheFaco]

About 2 months ago I bought 2 blaze rats from different sources, one with the standard blaze and one that had a possum face (I'm assuming both are controlled by the same gene, correct me if I'm wrong). They had one litter, and then the father died for unknown reasons, without any symptoms except for lethargy the morning he died. It wasn't until he died that I considered he and/or the female may have the dominant blaze.

She had a small litter, with only 2 surviving (all pups had blazes, no megacolon deaths). They turned 4 weeks old on the 8th. Unfortunately, the mother died yesterday from what I think was a miscarriage or pyrometra, so I can't do a test breeding to see if she has the recessive blaze. The pups are growing pretty well but their fur looks a little thin, which I read can be a symptom of megacolon. I use GEM white shavings and they're fed Native Earth 4018. I also sprinkle diatomaceous earth on their bedding. Here's a shot of the female;


Could it just be a molt? Is there any way to visually distinguish between the dominant and recessive blazes?


And I have a couple rats that I'd like some help with regarding their colors. I've looked at many different sites but haven't been able to figure out what this guy is, I'm thinking beige or champagne? His eyes are really dark, I was sure they were black before I snapped the shots;




The other blaze is in this one too, you can see the thinning fur on his face;


I have what I believe are 2 blue girls, though I'm not sure on the agouti one. Is this girl an American blue?


And here's the agouti girl, the photos make her look a lot more browned out than she is in person;



Thanks in advance for any help.

[sorraia]

Do you know approximately how old the male and female were? Having them both die unexpectedly is alarming, however if the female did die due to birthing complications or an infection, that is not necessarily something that will affect the weaned babies.

Having said that... I am not aware of any ways to tell recessive blazes from dominant blazes, other than to look at markings as a whole and know the bloodlines the rats came from. If you don't know bloodlines, you'll have to rely on markings. Looking at the pictures, I personally don't see anything that screams dominant spotting. They look to me like fairly typical H-locus markings. Test breeding for blazing isn't going to be reliable either, because if the blazing is recessive, you'll need to be sure your test cross does NOT carry the recessive gene. If any of the animals in the group have blazing or head spots, there's a good chance some of the non-blazed animals carry the gene, so test mating won't be reliable. The biggest concern with the dominant spotting is megacolon, which you should see signs of. You'll need to look for failure to thrive (smaller, thinner than normal), lethargy, appetite disturbances, constipation, unusual stools (massive watery stools instead of normal pellets), and bloat. I don't see the thinning fur you are describing, so I'm inclined to think that may just be moulting. If any of the babies are rex (looks like one might be), that alone would explain the thinning fur (rex are NOTORIOUS for thin fur, especially when moulting, and especially as they age).

As for colors...
First guy is beige. His color does look light, but that may be due to age, or he may carry other recessives that are lightening it. The darker eyes indicate beige instead of champagne, which would have pink/red eyes.

The blaze pictured with the beige is an agouti.

Next one is indeed American blue.

The picture of the agouti girl actually makes her look like a grayed cinnamon (mink + agouti), or maybe a Russian Blue agouti. It's harder to tell since you say the photo makes her look more brown than she truly is. I would say she definitely has something else going on with the agouti though. I'm inclined to say Blue or Russian Blue.

[TacoTheFaco]

Do you know approximately how old the male and female were? Having them both die unexpectedly is alarming, however if the female did die due to birthing complications or an infection, that is not necessarily something that will affect the weaned babies.

Having said that... I am not aware of any ways to tell recessive blazes from dominant blazes, other than to look at markings as a whole and know the bloodlines the rats came from. If you don't know bloodlines, you'll have to rely on markings. Looking at the pictures, I personally don't see anything that screams dominant spotting. They look to me like fairly typical H-locus markings. Test breeding for blazing isn't going to be reliable either, because if the blazing is recessive, you'll need to be sure your test cross does NOT carry the recessive gene. If any of the animals in the group have blazing or head spots, there's a good chance some of the non-blazed animals carry the gene, so test mating won't be reliable. The biggest concern with the dominant spotting is megacolon, which you should see signs of. You'll need to look for failure to thrive (smaller, thinner than normal), lethargy, appetite disturbances, constipation, unusual stools (massive watery stools instead of normal pellets), and bloat. I don't see the thinning fur you are describing, so I'm inclined to think that may just be moulting. If any of the babies are rex (looks like one might be), that alone would explain the thinning fur (rex are NOTORIOUS for thin fur, especially when moulting, and especially as they age).

As for colors...
First guy is beige. His color does look light, but that may be due to age, or he may carry other recessives that are lightening it. The darker eyes indicate beige instead of champagne, which would have pink/red eyes.

The blaze pictured with the beige is an agouti.

Next one is indeed American blue.

The picture of the agouti girl actually makes her look like a grayed cinnamon (mink + agouti), or maybe a Russian Blue agouti. It's harder to tell since you say the photo makes her look more brown than she truly is. I would say she definitely has something else going on with the agouti though. I'm inclined to say Blue or Russian Blue.

Thanks for your reply, I really appreciate the info.

The male was an adult when I got him, and the store employee said he had been there for several weeks so there is the chance he was an older rat. I hadn't even considered that.

The female I'm thinking was 2-3 months old when I got her. The day before she died she had brownish vaginal discharge that lead to a semi thick bloody discharge. I couldn't feel any obstruction or pup in her pelvis when I palpated her, but I thought I felt pups inside her.

I was considering opening her body up to try to find out what happened but I didn't have the heart to. My friend named her Shenanigans and she was incredible sweet. I'm glad her kids don't look like they have typical dominant blazing.


Here are a couple of pictures that show the agouti girl's color a lot better;



Sorry about the crappy shots, she's pretty skittish. Her eyes came out really, really dark red in several photos, you can kinda see it in the second one.

[sorraia]

Thanks for your reply, I really appreciate the info.

The male was an adult when I got him, and the store employee said he had been there for several weeks so there is the chance he was an older rat. I hadn't even considered that.

The female I'm thinking was 2-3 months old when I got her. The day before she died she had brownish vaginal discharge that lead to a semi thick bloody discharge. I couldn't feel any obstruction or pup in her pelvis when I palpated her, but I thought I felt pups inside her.

That does sound like she had an infection of some kind going on. Considering those circumstances... I would say, be watchful of the pups, but don't be overly concerned about their markings unless you see more evidence there is a problem.

Those new pictures of the agouti girl makes her look a lot like a Russian Blue agouti I used to have. You said her eyes look dark in the photos. Are they black or ruby? If ruby, she might be mink. I'm not sure off hand was mink+Russian blue + agouti looks like. Or she might just be a really grayish cinnamon...