Heat Tape

[kitedemon]

Not to down THG but flexwatt is in 1000s of homes and have been running for years. I remember seeing it years ago for heating bathroom floors, didn't know it was the same company.

As far as testing goes flexwatt has been used over and over again.
Now is it the safest thing for our snakes? I don't know. I'm running both in my home.
Sounds like both products rely on the t-stat not failing.

Good points. I would like to see heating products that basically will never over heat or at least have a very low possibility of over heating during a failure. Aarons testing he did between them showed the RB tape to run hotter than flexwatt I was shocked by this. I would hope that both will address this and figure out a way to reduce and maintain a max operational temp. That is low enough that in the event of a tstat failure no lasting harm will come to the animals it is heating.

[mattb]

Robyn I have been in the thin film technology business for a long time and will be running a lot of tests on your new product. I know that EVERY Korean product changes watt density and they run from it once it fails. I wish you guys had have reached out to us first to discuss what you saw as the down falls of our product but that is history. We will never be as low priced as a cheap imitation knock off but we have a quality product. If I hear another lie about Caloriques film or Calorique in general (and rememeber we have been doing this for 30+ years) I will be posting photos of your product before and after testing. They are not pretty.

I am sorry I had to throw my 2 cents in on the bolded parts of this comment.
First part says you will be running a lot of tests on their new product. To me this implies that you have yet to run said tests.

Second bolded part sounds so much like a threat. That you will post pics before and after said tests that you have not done yet due to your first comment then saying that they won't be pretty. How would you know that they would not be pretty due to the fact that you have not run any tests as of yet.

I will say that anything and everything can be made to fail if you try hard enough. Your product included.

I will say that I do not know Chad and Robyn from Pro Exotics, or Rich from Reptile Basics. Though I have ordered things from Rich before and would have nothing to say about him but good things. Ed I don't know you either though I have emailed your company a while ago and did not hear any reply back for about a month.

May I point out that Chad and Robyn of Pro Exotics I don't think would ever put out a product that wasn't tested and deemed to be safe after the terrible loss that they had to deal with from the fire that happened at their facility in September of 2011 which no one in this hobby could ever forget.

With all that said having something produced for this hobby by people in this hobby is always a good thing and it is something that I will support until someone gives me a good enough reason not to support them without throwing out things that sound like threats.

[PitOnTheProwl]

so who manufactures it??

Kind of curious who they are.

How much heat film they have installed?

This is just a stupid question in my mind!! How much had you installed in 1980 when you first hit the market??

We will never be as low priced as a cheap imitation knock off but we have a quality product.

So anyone that tries to make a product to give you competition in automatically a "cheap imitation knock off"?

If I hear another lie about Caloriques film or Calorique in general (and rememeber we have been doing this for 30+ years) I will be posting photos of your product before and after testing. They are not pretty.

Pony up the mouth of that horse you are riding and post VIDEO of your testings just because anyone can do what they want to a product and then fudge the photos however they want. until then you are starting to sound like the southern end of that pony with threats you might not be able to back up.


BTW, if everyone uses their brain a little...................... We are talking about an electrical product and anyone can make it fail if you try to. The question is will it fail under normal operations of its maximum normal usage limit?

[Ed gilmartin]

Kind of curious who they are.


This is just a stupid question in my mind!! How much had you installed in 1980 when you first hit the market??
I am replying to THG claims that they have millions of installs around the world and in S. Korea. If that is the case I think it would be OK to post info on the manufacturer so you guys can have piece of mind.


So anyone that tries to make a product to give you competition in automatically a "cheap imitation knock off"?
No there is one other company that does it very well also. That is it. the Koreans cut corners and use cheap material. Thay also have no idea how to stabalize the ink.



Pony up the mouth of that horse you are riding and post VIDEO of your testings just because anyone can do what they want to a product and then fudge the photos however they want. until then you are starting to sound like the southern end of that pony with threats you might not be able to back up.
We started the testing on 12/10. This is only the first of the tests to check for resistance change. It goes into an oven at 85C as per most listing bodies. After 6 days the ink became untable and the resistance dropped by 16%. it is hard to shoot video of this because it woudl be days of seeing no change. What I think might be the best thing to do is have the guy that posted the results of his test try it in 3 months again to show the difference in the korean product and the same heat levels in ours. It is put in an 85C oven to speed the process up. You can find that test on ULs website. The reason this happens is the cheap bus bars that dont have any reinforcement with silver and a tin plate oxidizes and the product starts to burn up. the ink then becomes very unstable and resistance changes. In a few months we will know exactly who manufacturers this product because we can match it with the resistance change in other korean products.

BTW, if everyone uses their brain a little...................... We are talking about an electrical product and anyone can make it fail if you try to. The question is will it fail under normal operations of its maximum normal usage limit?

Even though the testing speeds the process up the whole point is to show that over time the product will become too hot or too cold. We have tested Korean products that are ment for floor warming and ended upp being able to melt about 4 inches of snow per hour. this is not safe for anyone let alone reptiles. No electrical tests for arching and sparking have been done yet until we get the new connectors they use.

[Ed gilmartin]

I am sorry I had to throw my 2 cents in on the bolded parts of this comment.
First part says you will be running a lot of tests on their new product. To me this implies that you have yet to run said tests.

Second bolded part sounds so much like a threat. That you will post pics before and after said tests that you have not done yet due to your first comment then saying that they won't be pretty. How would you know that they would not be pretty due to the fact that you have not run any tests as of yet.

I will say that anything and everything can be made to fail if you try hard enough. Your product included.

I will say that I do not know Chad and Robyn from Pro Exotics, or Rich from Reptile Basics. Though I have ordered things from Rich before and would have nothing to say about him but good things. Ed I don't know you either though I have emailed your company a while ago and did not hear any reply back for about a month.

May I point out that Chad and Robyn of Pro Exotics I don't think would ever put out a product that wasn't tested and deemed to be safe after the terrible loss that they had to deal with from the fire that happened at their facility in September of 2011 which no one in this hobby could ever forget.

With all that said having something produced for this hobby by people in this hobby is always a good thing and it is something that I will support until someone gives me a good enough reason not to support them without throwing out things that sound like threats.

I just want to start by saying my original reason for coming on here was to correct the lies about Calorique. I have now gotten way too involved but will not allow any lies to be spread about us. We never had an issue or a complaint from Reptile basics so I agree they are a reputable company. I would not have worried about their "new" product until I read the original post on this thread and had to correct it. We have run the fisrt oven test that is done by testing bodies. It failed miserably. I would recomend the guy who posted his own results try again in a few months and post the changes side by side because I agree I could make their product fail if I wanted to very easily. that is not my goal. I have no issue with competition when all sides are being honest. It wont be long until you hear something bad about the new heat tape. I just hope you guys will blame the product that fails and not all radiant heat films. It happened to us in Canada and I dont want that to repeat.

[Ed gilmartin]

Good points. I would like to see heating products that basically will never over heat or at least have a very low possibility of over heating during a failure. Aarons testing he did between them showed the RB tape to run hotter than flexwatt I was shocked by this. I would hope that both will address this and figure out a way to reduce and maintain a max operational temp. That is low enough that in the event of a tstat failure no lasting harm will come to the animals it is heating.

We are working very hard on a self regulating ink. this came about due to the japanese market using futons as opposed to couches causing over heating problems. We have been working on it for a couple of years and it is close to being ready for UL. As soon as it is good to go we will make an announcment and make sure your industry is included as opposed to an aftertought. We already have a product but it would be way to expensive right now unless we can tweek the manufacturing process whcih we are working on. Dont count on the new SRI coming out this year. We put it to an internal test that is as long as ULs test for full listings. That means at a bare minimum it is probabaly 400 days out. If the other product that is already listed can be made at a lower cost I will let you guys know. We hope to have a dedicated reptile rep soon.

[Ed gilmartin]

I'm sure everyone here would like to see the pics.

Is flexwatt the same stuff that they use to do heated floors, like in bathrooms?


I don't mind paying extra as long as I know it's safe. I don't think making a product cheaper should be a main goal here. Even $1 more per foot would only add on $10-15 more on a rack that you are already paying $400-500 on.

I want my animals and house safe. That's my main concern.

Yes it is used for:

Floor heat
Tile heat with built in anti fracture membrane
United States military targets (thermal vision)
Primary home heat (in ceiling)
Driveway/walkway/stair snow melt and deicing
Portable deicing mats
Reptile heat tape
Truck roof deicing and snow melting
Airplane wing deicing (in development)
Agriculture root zone quick grow (allow greenhouses to grow year round regardless of temp)
etc

Some if these are primary business' and some are a by product of what we manufacture. reptile heat tape is being elevated to the primary catagory not that we have a slightly better understanding of your needs.

[MrLang]

Kudos for standing up to the heat of internet forum debate. I'm surprised nobody has been flinging poo over spelling and grammar errors yet.

At the end of the day, I'll be using a thermostat that fails in the OFF position and replacing my tape every few years since it's quite cheap, all things considered. What will likely make the difference to me is which product is easier for me to source.

1. There are only a few places to purchase this kind of heat tape by the foot, the way we prefer in this application of the product. What would help me out as a consumer is having it more available through more vendors. In some cases shipping can cost more than the tape itself.

2. I think the vast majority of keepers run their tape at 96 - 100 degrees on their T-stat. Thermostats are one of the most expensive pieces of equipment for anyone pursuing herpetoculture. A tape or line of tapes that max out at different temps would revolutionize the industry.

3. The strength of the laminate is the only quality of interest.

[3skulls]

Ed,
Can you give us tips or insight on the best possible way we can use your product?

Probe placement, how to attach the probe, when stacking cages is it best to leave an air gap? The best clips to use, is soldering better?

As we wait maybe you guys can take a look on how we use your product. Give us steps on the best and safest way we can use it.

[Ed gilmartin]

Ed,
Can you give us tips or insight on the best possible way we can use your product?

Probe placement, how to attach the probe, when stacking cages is it best to leave an air gap? The best clips to use, is soldering better?

As we wait maybe you guys can take a look on how we use your product. Give us steps on the best and safest way we can use it.

Is it possible to email me or post a pic of your set up as well as the thermostat and probe you use? I dont want to guess and not fully understand yoru set up or even a typical set up. I am not that familiar with your industry but once we have a dedicated rep we can be proactive and post all the best practices. Thanks