Super Calico

[snakesRkewl]

I keep getting told there is no dominant traits in ball pythons

Super spiders, super pinstripes, super calico and all those "dominant" traits must have a super form.
But there's no proof since they all die in the egg, during development of the follicle, or after hatching.
Good luck getting any proof on the calico, we can't even figure out the spider or pinstripe genes

[OctagonGecko729]

If that were the case wouldn't people who are dealing with so called dominant traits end up having significantly reduced production of viable hatchlings? Whether it be less eggs, more infertile eggs, dead in the egg, or dead shortly after hatching (such as the pearl). I'm new to BPs but I have not come across any evidence which suggests that all these dominant traits are actually co-dom and that the super form is fatal.

[CollideOverMe]

The walking thread...

[OhhWatALoser]

I keep getting told there is no dominant traits in ball pythons

Super spiders, super pinstripes, super calico and all those "dominant" traits must have a super form.
But there's no proof since they all die in the egg, during development of the follicle, or after hatching.
Good luck getting any proof on the calico, we can't even figure out the spider or pinstripe genes

We've been through this before..... Pinstripe has evidence of being truly dominant and there is zero evidence to suggest a lethal homozygous form, yet you keep repeating it is lethal. Here we have claims of a homozygous calico...might be proven by now, hence the thread revival.

If that were the case wouldn't people who are dealing with so called dominant traits end up having significantly reduced production of viable hatchlings? Whether it be less eggs, more infertile eggs, dead in the egg, or dead shortly after hatching (such as the pearl). I'm new to BPs but I have not come across any evidence which suggests that all these dominant traits are actually co-dom and that the super form is fatal.

Well the spider it may be the case, in the few people who have posted actual numbers, there was a slug or two in the clutch. Also somewhat recently someone posted a picture of a dead white snake that they said came from a spider x spider pairing. I just find it odd this is the first time someone publicly posted one. But then again, I've never seen someone attempt to prove out a homozygous spider. Nothings set in stone but recent evidence isn't looking good for the homozygous spider.

[snakesRkewl]

We've been through this before..... Pinstripe has evidence of being truly dominant and there is zero evidence to suggest a lethal homozygous form, yet you keep repeating it is lethal. Here we have claims of a homozygous calico...might be proven by now, hence the thread revival.

I don't think it's lethal, I don't think it exist period
Joe Ellis, let's put a name on this, is the one who is so sure that there is no such thing as a dominant trait in ball pythons.
Maybe Joe would be so nice to come explain?

I care less actually, I hope there is no super forms of these dominant traits, it will only kill the market even more for those genetics.

[OctagonGecko729]

Well the spider it may be the case, in the few people who have posted actual numbers, there was a slug or two in the clutch. Also somewhat recently someone posted a picture of a dead white snake that they said came from a spider x spider pairing. I just find it odd this is the first time someone publicly posted one. But then again, I've never seen someone attempt to prove out a homozygous spider. Nothings set in stone but recent evidence isn't looking good for the homozygous spider.

Hopefully that is not the case, I'm going to be running several spider combo crosses and half sibling breeding in the next 1-4 years. I'll post the results here of course.

Where is the picture of this supposed homozygous spider that was dead? Do you know the parent morphs?

[OhhWatALoser]

Hopefully that is not the case, I'm going to be running several spider combo crosses and half sibling breeding in the next 1-4 years. I'll post the results here of course.

Where is the picture of this supposed homozygous spider that was dead? Do you know the parent morphs?

The thread was on blbc ill find it when I get home, i barely get Internet out here.

[OhhWatALoser]

I don't think it's lethal, I don't think it exist period
Joe Ellis, let's put a name on this, is the one who is so sure that there is no such thing as a dominant trait in ball pythons.
Maybe Joe would be so nice to come explain?

I would gladly talk to him.


as for the thread I was referring to, post 13 http://www.reptileradio.net/reptiler...Spider-Results, now personally I think people are quick to jump to set in stone lethal homozygous, especially since this is the first one to ever be posted (that I know of), But it is no doubt damning evidence. Repeat it with another unrelated pair of spiders... I think we have our answer, even if it takes many attempts to get one to go full term.

[OctagonGecko729]

I'm completely new to BPs as a whole. How long has the spider gene been available to the masses? In the $500-1500 range? I know Kevin does a ton of spider x spider stuff but I can't imagine he is the only one doing it on a massive scale. A homozygous spider (if lethal) would produce a 25% reduction in offspring right? So you would "statistically" always lose at least one egg. I would think that folks would have noticed that by now, that every spider x spider cross produces 1/4th reduction. Also, back to the pinstripe deal, if a homozygous pinstripe could exist wouldn't it act like a super form? All offspring would have one visual gene in them right, which has not to my knowledge ever been proven. Isn't it completely possible that spider is simply a dominant trait which has no homozygous form?

I am planning on crossing one male spider combo with two female spider combos when the females are up to size. So I'll post my findings but that won't be till January 2014 or so.


NM all that ^...I reread your points two-three posts back, makes sense.