Right Supplements?

[AaronAshley]

Hi everyone,

I recently took my female ball python to the vet to see about a respiratory infection because she was whistling when she breathes. The vet (an actual herp vet) said she was in great health, but couldn't find a respiratory infection. He prescribed her the antibiotic Baytril just to make sure. Every other day, I give her a 0.5 liquid dose orally. He told me, though she was in great condition, I should buy her a general multivitamin. I bought her "Exoterra Multi Vitamin", and it says it's for reptiles and amphibians. The feeding instructions include instructions on how to feed to reptiles that eat fruit and insects, but not rats like my ball eats. I'm wondering if anyone knows if this supplement is okay to use with snakes? Has anyone ever used this product before? If so, how much should I use to coat her rats in? Thanks!

[Mike41793]

Your snakes get all the nutrition they need from healthy rodents.

[The Serpent Merchant]

None Supplements are completely unnecessary and a waste of money.

[Stewart_Reptiles]

BP get everything they need from their prey item and while the supplement will likely not hurt your BP it is unnecessary and a waste of money.

couldn't find a respiratory infection. He prescribed her the antibiotic Baytril just to make sure.

Based on everything you wrote and especially what I quoted I would recommend finding another vet, seems like the one you found will do about anything to jack up the bill.

You don't prescribe antibiotics just in case or to make sure

[kitedemon]

The advise of the vet seems odd Baytril in case? Seems odd Baytril is old and not very effective because of over usage just like human antibiotics over usage creates resistant bacteria. Oral is also uncommon as the digestion is so slow. How long is the treatment time line?

The supplements I actually understand, rodents are as good as the way they are kept and what they are fed, freezing damages some vitamins and minerals. careful use of a supplement (every few meals) is not going to hurt and it is likely will help to replace any deficiencies in rodent diet and from freezing. If you breed your own and feed a high grade diet, with fresh offerings as well it is much more of a question. If you buy the rodents, I would go ahead and add a little bit.

BHB did a thing with supplemented snakes and not supplemented snakes fed alike and the growth difference was quite clear.

I like the Reptasol for just general supplement. http://www.bigreptileworld.co.uk/rep...ment-111-p.asp

For animals under stress I would recommend either Vetark Reptoboost or benabac reptile one is a pro biotic/vitamin for dehydration and countering effects of drugs, the other is just a pro biotic again useful in countering drugs. I inject rodents with the correct amount benabac is a measured dose the Vetark Reptoboost I inject rodents (F/T) with about 1ml per 50 gm of rat.

I would guess the supplements are intended to repopulate the stomach loss due to the anti bacterial drug for the RI. Benabac is commonly available the others likely would need ordering.

http://www.bigreptileworld.co.uk/sup...ducts-11-c.asp

[satomi325]

Sorry to say it, but it doesn't sound like that vet is very experienced with herps.
The key indicator being oral medication, baytril, and not taking a culture.

If you or the vet are unsure about the RI, a culture should be done to identify the illness(bacterial infection in most cases).
Oral antibiotics for RI are almost useless because snakes have slow metabolism. Most antibiotics for RI are injected directly into the snake.
And like kitedemon stated, Baytrill is sort of old school default antibiotics.

Is your snake wheezing? Is there any mucus in it's mouth? Or just the whistles?
Sometimes they get stuck shed in their nose and whistle.

[AaronAshley]

Thanks everyone, your replies have been very informative! I completely understand with all of you. I know that supplements are not natural, therefore a snake can live very healthily without them. I personally feed frozen/thawed, therefore I think some nutrients could be lost during the freezing process. I don't intend on feeding her supplements every meal, just on occasion to keep her boosted. And I am a huge fan on BHB (of course) and his segment on vitamins proved great results.

To be more clear about the whole situation, my vet suggested Baytril because he didn't really believe there was an R.I., however, it couldn't hurt to try and where I'm from, Baytril is relatively inexpensive so I didn't mind trying it out. She doesn't have any mucus or difficulty breathing, just an occasional whistle. I think she may have a piece of her last shed or perhaps some substrate (I use coconut husk) stuck in her nose. My vet suggests getting some x-rays done if the Baytril doesn't clear things up. I personally am not a fan of the idea of x-rays, they are 200$ off the bat. He took a fecal culture last time I was there, and didn't find anything abnormal.

I bascially just want to make sure I'm not feeding my snake a vitamin that will harm her. I know others have methods/opinions different than mine and that's perfectly okay Just wanted to see if anyone has used the product "Exo Terra Multivitamin".

- - - Updated - - -

Just to add though, my vet is an actual herp vet. I even asked to see the certificates. He's about as qualified as I can get in my area. I of course appreciate all your concerns and opinions, however I have a great relationship with my vet and will most likely continue to see him. I'm aware that some vets do like to sell certain products, but in this case, I don't think a multivitamin is such a terrible idea If anyone has suggestions for herp vets in the Halifax, Canada area, I would of course love to hear from you

[dav4]

For the record, Baytril, also known as enrofloxacin, is not "old school" or inneffective. It's an extremely broad spectrum antibiotic that is still very effective despite having been around for a while. The problem is that baytril, along with most other antibiotics, is being over-prescribed, or prescribed in situations where they will be inneffective, such as in the presence of a viral infection only, or NO infection. These instances, along with folks not completing the entire course of medication, are allowing certain bacteria to develop resistance. Again, baytril is not outdated, is more likely to be effective against many bacterial infections, and can be given as an injection, which is great for herps. It just needs to be used in the right situation.

[Skiploder]

Thanks everyone, your replies have been very informative! I completely understand with all of you. I know that supplements are not natural, therefore a snake can live very healthily without them. I personally feed frozen/thawed, therefore I think some nutrients could be lost during the freezing process. I don't intend on feeding her supplements every meal, just on occasion to keep her boosted. And I am a huge fan on BHB (of course) and his segment on vitamins proved great results.

To be more clear about the whole situation, my vet suggested Baytril because he didn't really believe there was an R.I., however, it couldn't hurt to try and where I'm from, Baytril is relatively inexpensive so I didn't mind trying it out. She doesn't have any mucus or difficulty breathing, just an occasional whistle. I think she may have a piece of her last shed or perhaps some substrate (I use coconut husk) stuck in her nose. My vet suggests getting some x-rays done if the Baytril doesn't clear things up. I personally am not a fan of the idea of x-rays, they are 200$ off the bat. He took a fecal culture last time I was there, and didn't find anything abnormal.

I bascially just want to make sure I'm not feeding my snake a vitamin that will harm her. I know others have methods/opinions different than mine and that's perfectly okay Just wanted to see if anyone has used the product "Exo Terra Multivitamin".

- - - Updated - - -

Just to add though, my vet is an actual herp vet. I even asked to see the certificates. He's about as qualified as I can get in my area. I of course appreciate all your concerns and opinions, however I have a great relationship with my vet and will most likely continue to see him. I'm aware that some vets do like to sell certain products, but in this case, I don't think a multivitamin is such a terrible idea If anyone has suggestions for herp vets in the Halifax, Canada area, I would of course love to hear from you

Deborah gave you good advice.

Your Vet is a boob.

He is a hack because he recommended a supplement for an animal that needs no supplementation. He graduated to full boobage when he prescribed an antibiotic as a prophylactic. It is because of cement heads like him that the efficacy of Baytril and other broad spectrum antibiotics is on the decrease and that RIs are getting harder and harder to treat.

Even if your snake had an RI, prescribing any antibiotic without doing a culture is reason enough to find another vet. When a vet puts the snake on an antibiotic "just to be safe", he joins the ranks of an elite group of asses that should be avoided by the community.

Giving antibiotic injections to snake is stressful for the snake and can lead to an actual stress related ailment. If your snake does not have an RI, do not give it Baytril. Your vet does not need to do a $200 xray to diagnose an RI, he can to a tracheal wash for much less.

A qualified herp vet would know that occasional whistling is normal in snakes. Snakes have a U-shaped wind pipe that has a slightly corrugated inside edge (as opposed to mammals that have a smooth O). This allows for the collapse or expansion of the windpipe when feeding. The corrugations are what cause the 'wheezing' sound when air rushes through with breathing.

Excitement, nerves, etc. all cause agitated breathing - which results in this noise. Shame on your vet for not knowing that.

[Capray]

…I don't think there are any fruit eating snakes.