Caramel glow + ??

[BlueMoonExotics]

To start I should say I'm brand new to ball pythons but I'm in the process of getting a Caramel glow. Yes I understand the kinking and fertility issues but I figure if I'm going to get one, then I should get one that I really wanted even if it does turn out to only be a pet. That being said, I'm trying to understand the genetics behind them and ball pythons in general. I've been reading until I'm blue in the face but it just doesn't seem to sink in I guess. So far I think I got a basic understanding that caramel glow is from a caramel albino + orange ghost? So what happens after you have the visual Caramel glow? What I mean is what are they compatible with to get more caramel glows? Also is there a way to combine them with something else to give you say...... a Caramel glow pied or a Caramel glow Mojave or is that even possible? I'm sure these questions are going to sound silly but I'm really curious to know what I can do with this girl later on down the road if I decide to breed her.

[Lupe]

Caramel and ghost are recessive, so to get one you need at the very least 2 double hets (het for both caramel and ghost) or a ghost het caramel or a caramel het ghost. (hope I haven't lost you yet!)
If you breed a CG (shorting the name up) to another CG you will get all caramel glows. Breed it to a ghost you will have ghost het caramels and the same the other way around.
Now a caramel ghost pied would be tricky because it is 3 recessive genes. If you already had a CG your best bet would be to breed it to a pied and then breed some of the triple het siblings together. Even then it is a 1/64 chance you would get a caramel glow pied.
http://www.worldofballpythons.com/wizard/
^what I used to get the results^

[BlueMoonExotics]

I've read though that you shouldn't breed a visual to a visual with the caramel glows because it can make the kinking issue worse. Is that true? I can understand having the hets for both caramel and ghost but you did lose me after that LOL. So I would need a male that had a gene for both a caramel and ghost to have a possibility of seeing a baby like her. When you say ghost het caramels that means they have the genes there but they would look like normals correct?

The pied does sound like it would be difficult. Still, knowing there is a possibility for a pied is very interesting. I think it might be worth it to try even if it did take me forever and a day!

I have seen the gene wizard but I would only know what the female was. I wouldn't know what male to get to pair her with to get the result I'm looking for. Thanks so much for the reply!

[Lupe]

Sorry, it's late here and I'm pretty tired xD and I'm not too familiar with many of the recessive morphs or the genetic link to kinking or other problems =/
A Ghost Het Caramel will look like a ghost but carry the caramel gene.
Just a thought but maybe you can look into making a completely new combo? There isn't many caramel combos as it is on the morph list. I think it would look amazing to add a morph the changes the pattern (spider, pin, enchi, the list goes on)
If you figure out the general direction you want to go (say Caramel Glow Mojave for example) the genetic wizard can be a big help.

And I know genetics can be confusing, I guess I'm lucky I've always had a knack for figuring them out (it was my favorite part of my biology class lol)

[BlueMoonExotics]

I would love to make something new with her. I just have no idea what would work. That's why I'm asking what male I could combine her with to get something that has her color (what drew me to her) but something different added in like a pied or just any different design would be awesome. If anyone has any suggestions to try I would definitely look into them. Of course it is still awhile off but having an idea of what I want early on gives me time to prepare and keep an eye out for a good male.

[BlueMoonExotics]

Ok after some major headaches trying to force learn genetics .....I THINK i'm starting to understand ..... kind of lol. So I'm going to give an example and someone please correct me if I'm wrong..... sorry for being such a noob!

If I wanted to get a caramel glow mojave I would first breed her to a mojave which would give me babies that are mojave het for caramel glow? The babies would have the genes for both caramel glow and mojave. I then take the babies and breed them together to get caramel glow mojave babies? Then outbreed from there I'm guessing. Seems like there must be a lot of inbreeding then in ball pythons to get all of these weird morphs.

[coldbloodaddict]

The odds of getting a female Caramel to lay a good full clutch of eggs is very very rare...You should not waste you time and money on a Caramel Glow female!

Get into Ultramels, the females don't kink and lay good clutches.

If you're stuck on Caramels (wouldn't know why with all the info about them) at least get a male Caramel Glow...Breed him and make Double Hets then breed him back to them...Female Hets don't seem to have any fertility issues so that's would be the best avenue.

[BlueMoonExotics]

Thanks for the info Coldblood but I've already started paying on her. Like I said though, if she does only turn out to be a pet I'm fine with that too. My animals are always pets first and breeders second. I am aware that the females can have egg issues but the breeder has also offered to give advice once I get to that point to make it as smooth as possible. The Ultramels are ok I guess but in my opinion not nearly as pretty. In the future I might look into it more but for now she's got my undivided attention

[OhhWatALoser]

there are quite a few who have zero issues or close to it all season long with caramels, no kinking and nice clutches from caramel females. Not saying they aren't prone to it, obviously they are, but I wouldn't call it rare at all, in fact it seems to be the more common among breeders I have asked.

[BlueMoonExotics]

Yes, the breeder has said he has had very few issues with kinking and told me when the time comes he's willing to give me some advice on how to avoid it. She's definitely a beautiful girl and I fell in love with her and have no intentions of changing my mind now. When I get her I'll post up some pictures and I think some may agree