Thoughts on Heating

[Badgemash]

I am planning out my soon to be stacking cage setup, and am leaning toward the Boaphile stacking cages. But since I am new to this sort of set up I fell like I don't entirely understand how the heating should done. I should add a bit of background, the hubby says that I can do whatever I want as long as it comes out of my paycheck, and I can have as many snakes as I want, as long as they all fit in one room (as in I can have a spare bedroom that only contains snakes and a small work desk), but he would like it if we can actually see them (so no tub racks). Over the next few years I'm planning to increase the collection to somewhere in the neighborhood of 20+ animals to support future axanthic projects (fingers crossed some of those will be Bubbles' babies). Although I probably will end up selling off some hatchlings, I'm not thinking of this as a business, these animals are my pets and I want the best possible environment for them.

With that said, what is the best way to heat them? Radiant heat panels seem to offer the most natural option. But I doubt snakes in the wild hide inside plastic containers, which is what mine seem to spend most of their time doing. How deeply does the heat from these actually penetrate? This makes me think flexwatt would be the more effective option since I could be sure the heat would actually get to them. Is there a strong argument for one over the other? On the pricing side, yes flexwatt is cheaper, but do radiant panels use less power? I don't want to save in the short term if it's going to cost me more in the long term. Finally, how do people regulate heat on that many tanks? Do you really just add a herpstat for every cage? Or is there a larger scale system that I haven't read about yet?

Sorry, I know that's a lot of questions. I just want to do things correctly and consistently from the start. Thanks!

[BleedingOrange36]

I am planning out my soon to be stacking cage setup, and am leaning toward the Boaphile stacking cages. But since I am new to this sort of set up I fell like I don't entirely understand how the heating should done. I should add a bit of background, the hubby says that I can do whatever I want as long as it comes out of my paycheck, and I can have as many snakes as I want, as long as they all fit in one room (as in I can have a spare bedroom that only contains snakes and a small work desk), but he would like it if we can actually see them (so no tub racks). Over the next few years I'm planning to increase the collection to somewhere in the neighborhood of 20+ animals to support future axanthic projects (fingers crossed some of those will be Bubbles' babies). Although I probably will end up selling off some hatchlings, I'm not thinking of this as a business, these animals are my pets and I want the best possible environment for them.

With that said, what is the best way to heat them? Radiant heat panels seem to offer the most natural option. But I doubt snakes in the wild hide inside plastic containers, which is what mine seem to spend most of their time doing. How deeply does the heat from these actually penetrate? This makes me think flexwatt would be the more effective option since I could be sure the heat would actually get to them. Is there a strong argument for one over the other? On the pricing side, yes flexwatt is cheaper, but do radiant panels use less power? I don't want to save in the short term if it's going to cost me more in the long term. Finally, how do people regulate heat on that many tanks? Do you really just add a herpstat for every cage? Or is there a larger scale system that I haven't read about yet?

Sorry, I know that's a lot of questions. I just want to do things correctly and consistently from the start. Thanks!

Im fairly new to this myself, so use my suggestions supplemented with other more experienced people.
I believe if you use all the same wattage heating elements ( flexwatt, or a radiant) mounted the same way, with the same thickness of substrate, you can get by with a single thermostat granted you don't exceed wattage limits.
Or if some tanks use a radiant heater, and some use flexwatt..... Invest in a herpstat 2. If you have varying heating elements, up to 4 different types or wattages, I would go with a herpstat 4.

[The Serpent Merchant]

Radiant heat panels use the same or more power than flexwatt does.

Radiant heat panels are better overall, they heat everything below them whereas flexwatt only heats up the floor of the cage. This limits the substrates that you can use.

To regulate them all I would suggest that you get Herpstat 4's. The Herpstat 4 has 4 independent thermostats in a single package. It is exactly like having 4 individual Herpstat 1's in a single box. They are more cost effective as well. Some people will use a single Herpstat to regulate an entire stack of cages. While it can be done I don't recomend it.

[Gene Collins]

I would definitely recommend flexwatt for belly heat and only use panels if you have trouble with ambient temps in your enclosures. BPs aren't basking reptiles so they don't need a warm spot in the open to lay under. BPs need belly heat under a hiding spot so they can curl up and be warm when they want to. I am not entirely familiar with radiant panels but I would guess flexwatt is cheaper not only to buy but to run. The 11 inch tape is only 20 watts per foot. I think the 4 inch is 6 or 8 watts per foot.

I too am curious about how to go about regulating multiple enclosures via thermostat. I am going to build a tub rack and I was wondering if I need a thermostat for each shelf/tub or could one operate the whole rack. I am going with the one long flexwatt strip woven up the rack.

And just as a post this Serpent Merchant answers my question lol

[Badgemash]

Radiant heat panels use the same or more power than flexwatt does.

Radiant heat panels are better overall, they heat everything below them whereas flexwatt only heats up the floor of the cage. This limits the substrates that you can use.

To regulate them all I would suggest that you get Herpstat 4's. The Herpstat 4 has 4 independent thermostats in a single package. It is exactly like having 4 individual Herpstat 1's in a single box. They are more cost effective as well. Some people will use a single Herpstat to regulate an entire stack of cages. While it can be done I don't recomend it.

So for 20 cages I would need 5 Herpstat 4s? Is this how the larger producers do it? I feel like there should be some kind of computerized big system, something that could control lots of cages at once, if not someone should invent one...

[The Serpent Merchant]

Using multiple herpstat 4's is the best solution currently. The problem is the cost involved with making a huge system. The closest thing that exists right now are profession lighting controllers used in theater. They use a central control board that sends signals to "dimmer packs" that actually vary the power going to the lights. This type of system could easily be altered to work as a big thermostat system, but at $10,000-$50,000 its cheaper to just buy a few herpstat 4's.

Larger breeders use rack systems that use a single thermostat and have 10-75 tubs each. This does reduce the safety as there are parts that aren't being directly regulated, but most of the time prove to be safe.

[kitedemon]

I would suggest that RHPs are not very appropriate for terrestrial set ups. I have two they are great products but at least in my rooms (cool room 77-60º summer winter or so) they simply do not heat what is needed to heat. My concerns is easy to explain. Where to you place the probe? If it is under the substrate the animal can come between the heat source and probe. This could easily cause over heating of the animal. Placing the probe on the face of the panel does not account for the ambient temps and needs to be constantly adjusted if the air temps vary. (making a T-stat basically pointless) that leaves a dangling placement/lifted placement. This leaves the probe free to move and cleaning difficult. Probes must not move. This is the best way I was able to get stable accurate temps but difficult to place and maintain. RHPs in tall enclosure s usually are placed on a basking area and if the animal becomes hot it will move lower. The set up is perfect for this case. Terrestrial enclosures vertical gradients are not what is required and RHPs do not easily make horizontal gradients.

Radiant heat...

"when electromagnetic waves travel through air, it is called radiation. When electromagnetic waves cone in contact with a object, the waves transfer heat to that object."

RADIANT does not heat air. Radiant heat panels ... do not heat air. The manufacturer states this, the laws of physics state this, the belief that can make any substantial difference to air temps is a myth. Air and water are heated by convection.

Personally with a number of enclosures the simplest method is to go with some type of UTH (flexwatt, heat cable, or commercial carbon resistive heater) This is easy, efficient and cheap to set up. If you have ambient air temp issues the room temp can be raised to a safe ambient temp simply (oil filled heater). This is efficient if all the animals are in a single room and the room is well insulated.