In the nude! what do you think?

[MrLang]

I really like how this devolved quite quickly into guys saying what they like appearance wise in a woman. Very good way to make women who don't meet the general "like" of curvy, feel insecure about themselves.

The thread is created by a woman and discussing female body image. What other way would a man chime in than to explain their point of view towards women? Should we just say 'you're beautiful inside no matter what!' I did not get the impression that was the goal of the thread. People are being honest. Most of the men chiming in are more or less saying that looks aren't as important as most women and the media make them out to be, anyway.

[Raptor]

The thread is created by a woman and discussing female body image. What other way would a man chime in than to explain their point of view towards women? Should we just say 'you're beautiful inside no matter what!' I did not get the impression that was the goal of the thread. People are being honest. Most of the men chiming in are more or less saying that looks aren't as important as most women and the media make them out to be, anyway.

If looks aren't important, then why the need to say "I like x"?

My statement wasn't one that was formed from this thread alone. I browse many forums, and this isn't the first time I've seen a conversation such as this pop up. In the rest of them, the general consensus was that curvy = good, everything else = bad.

Since we're being honest, here's my take on things. If you've got kickin' curves, awesome. Guys are going to be all over you. If you don't, well, too bad, so sad. Regardless of what people are trying to say, looks are important. It's a proven scientific fact. We're genetically hardwired to find certain shapes attractive. Unfortunately, those that aren't lucky enough to get the genes get kicked to the curb.

[RoseyReps]

If looks aren't important, then why the need to say "I like x"?

My statement wasn't one that was formed from this thread alone. I browse many forums, and this isn't the first time I've seen a conversation such as this pop up. In the rest of them, the general consensus was that curvy = good, everything else = bad.

Since we're being honest, here's my take on things. If you've got kickin' curves, awesome. Guys are going to be all over you. If you don't, well, too bad, so sad. Regardless of what people are trying to say, looks are important. It's a proven scientific fact. We're genetically hardwired to find certain shapes attractive. Unfortunately, those that aren't lucky enough to get the genes get kicked to the curb.

This imo, is a perfect example of how NOT to live. I'm a small girl. 5'3, 105lbs. By no means "curvy". I used to have a low self esteem like I am assuming you do (I apologize if my assumption is incorrect, but your demeanor in your posts have been that of someone who doesn't find worth in themselves) This thread didn't "devolve" into what men like, it's just men can't sit there and say how the media makes them feel about themselves as a women (you know..since they aren't) And most women aren't going to sit there and say what they think is attractive in another women, because most of them aren't attracted to women..So everyone's comments have been pretty on par with a thread such as this thus far. (I cannot speak for the other forums from which you say you've read similar threads obviously)

So guys on a forum like curvy women. So what? Being a tiny person myself, I never felt I was "kicked to the curb" because I wasn't large breasted and plump bootied. There are PLENTY of men out there, good men, who are attracted to every shape. I think the reasoning behind most men coming out in a thread like this saying how they like curves has nothing to do with everything else being sub par. But more about them proving to the OP that not all men like the super skinny chicks like the media likes to show.

I'll be 100% honest here, I did have a low self esteem with my first husband. He told me every day how I was lucky to have him, and how no one else would be interested in me. After hearing that for 4 years you start to believe it. When I finally woke up and left him, I did a lot of soul searching. (mind you, mostly in the form of bar hopping and excessive partying..) Anyways, I realized there where a whole slew of men who would be happy to have me. (no I don't mean like THAT...I mean guys interested in me and dating etc ) My self esteem started to come back up and I felt great. Then I met my husband Bill, and from that moment on my self esteem was much higher. I felt good about myself. I discussed it with him, and I went and got breast implants a while after having my second kiddo. It was a mommy's day present to myself, and though Bill didn't want me to do it, he knew it would make me feel that much better about myself. I didn't do it because I thought guys would like it more, I did it because it's what I wanted. It's what I wanted to see when I looked in the mirror, and I really don't give a hoot what others think. I didn't go crazy, and people who didn't know me pre op are super surprised when/if they find out. Does this make me a bad person and fake? Well, not to me. It might to you, or people in general, but honestly, I don't care. I am who I am, and as long as I'm happy with what I see in the mirror, I will not let anyone bring me down. Never again.

If you are unhappy with yourself, fix it. Don't let other people tell you what men want, in the end, who cares what men want. I care what I want, and I found a man who wants that too. Woot! When you are happy with yourself, you shine. Whether you're 100lbs, or 300lbs. You SHINE. Confidence and self esteem are worth more than anything. After all, how can you expect to love another, when you can't even love yourself? (I know I stole that line from somewhere, but I can't remember...so...whoops)

And Raptor, this whole reply wasn't meant directly at you. It's just your comments about devolving, and getting kicked to the curb metaphorically, reminded me so much of something I would have said 6 years ago...
Yes, looks are important. To a degree. They are the first impression. That doesn't mean that one type looks better than another, that is all based entirely on opinion. Looks are the cover of the book, they get your attention, but what's on the inside is what keeps your gaze and gets you to keep turning pages.

Sorry for the baggage dump LOL *packs up*

[Raptor]

This imo, is a perfect example of how NOT to live. I'm a small girl. 5'3, 105lbs. By no means "curvy". I used to have a low self esteem like I am assuming you do (I apologize if my assumption is incorrect, but your demeanor in your posts have been that of someone who doesn't find worth in themselves)

Lol. You're not tiny. I'm tiny. I'm 4'11" and a little over 80 pounds. I have zero curves, in fact, I'm built like boy that hasn't hit puberty. Bony? That too. No, I don't have much. Even as a child I didn't. What little I manage to scrape up tends to get obliterated by my family.

I'll be 100% honest here, I did have a low self esteem with my first husband. He told me every day how I was lucky to have him, and how no one else would be interested in me. After hearing that for 4 years you start to believe it. When I finally woke up and left him, I did a lot of soul searching. (mind you, mostly in the form of bar hopping and excessive partying..) Anyways, I realized there where a whole slew of men who would be happy to have me. (no I don't mean like THAT...I mean guys interested in me and dating etc ) My self esteem started to come back up and I felt great. Then I met my husband Bill, and from that moment on my self esteem was much higher. I felt good about myself. I discussed it with him, and I went and got breast implants a while after having my second kiddo. It was a mommy's day present to myself, and though Bill didn't want me to do it, he knew it would make me feel that much better about myself. I didn't do it because I thought guys would like it more, I did it because it's what I wanted. It's what I wanted to see when I looked in the mirror, and I really don't give a hoot what others think. I didn't go crazy, and people who didn't know me pre op are super surprised when/if they find out. Does this make me a bad person and fake? Well, not to me. It might to you, or people in general, but honestly, I don't care. I am who I am, and as long as I'm happy with what I see in the mirror, I will not let anyone bring me down. Never again.

I get told fairly often by my mother that the only way anyone will be interested in me is if I wear make up and completely change my wardrobe ("no one is interested in a woman that wears boys clothing" nevermind that's the only thing that fits me). This was further driven home at christmas when I was given nothing but makeup. Which I've only touched once for an awards ceremony.

If you are unhappy with yourself, fix it. Don't let other people tell you what men want, in the end, who cares what men want. I care what I want, and I found a man who wants that too. Woot! When you are happy with yourself, you shine. Whether you're 100lbs, or 300lbs. You SHINE. Confidence and self esteem are worth more than anything. After all, how can you expect to love another, when you can't even love yourself? (I know I stole that line from somewhere, but I can't remember...so...whoops)

Well, I'm not going to get taller and I can't stand heels in the least bit, so that's not going to change. I once dyed my hair green because it made me happy. When I was done, I was told by a family member to "come here so I can see how ugly you are". Love is really a strong word. I'm really only interested in companionship since I don't really have a wide range of emotions.

And Raptor, this whole reply wasn't meant directly at you. It's just your comments about devolving, and getting kicked to the curb metaphorically, reminded me so much of something I would have said 6 years ago...
Yes, looks are important. To a degree. They are the first impression. That doesn't mean that one type looks better than another, that is all based entirely on opinion. Looks are the cover of the book, they get your attention, but what's on the inside is what keeps your gaze and gets you to keep turning pages.

Then I'm up a metaphorical crap creek. I'm not that great on the outside, and the inside, well, that's enough to scare some people.

[wilomn]

Lol. You're not tiny. I'm tiny. I'm 4'11" and a little over 80 pounds. I have zero curves, in fact, I'm built like boy that hasn't hit puberty. Bony? That too. No, I don't have much. Even as a child I didn't. What little I manage to scrape up tends to get obliterated by my family.



I get told fairly often by my mother that the only way anyone will be interested in me is if I wear make up and completely change my wardrobe ("no one is interested in a woman that wears boys clothing" nevermind that's the only thing that fits me). This was further driven home at christmas when I was given nothing but makeup. Which I've only touched once for an awards ceremony.



Well, I'm not going to get taller and I can't stand heels in the least bit, so that's not going to change. I once dyed my hair green because it made me happy. When I was done, I was told by a family member to "come here so I can see how ugly you are". Love is really a strong word. I'm really only interested in companionship since I don't really have a wide range of emotions.



Then I'm up a metaphorical crap creek. I'm not that great on the outside, and the inside, well, that's enough to scare some people.

I've been around a couple of blocks more than a couple of times. Do what makes you happy and sooner or later you'll find someone to compliment that. The trick is knowing that someone when opportunity knocks. Stay strong and confident. One of my exes, with whom I parted on good terms, was literally 4'10". If I turned around without looking I could knock her over without trying. There really is someone for everyone.

[RoseyReps]

Raptor,
Throw the make up away. Dye your hair green and wear whatever the hell you want. I didn't mean fix it as in do things that other people think help. Do things to fix you for yourself. Your family saying those things is not a good place to be. As others have stated, there is compainionship for everyone. My husband and I own a little local hole in the wall bar. There is this girl that comes in, and she is about 4'8 4'10 Max. She is, by far, the life of the place when she comes in. She runs around and goofs off having a great time, she has purple hair, wears boyish clothes and turns every head in our place. She sings karaoke and people love to pick her up randomly. She is freaking awesome. She...sounds a lot like you. If you could get past what the people around you are saying...and I know that's hard.. but surround yourself with positive people. It takes time, but you can build that confidence. Being short is a pain, but it has it's perks. Like asking tall guys to help you reach the top shelf I wish you were close to us. I would love to introduce you to her and take you out with people who won't tell you how you should dress etc.

Oh, and I hate make up. I only wear it maybe 3-4 times a year at most. I prefer my boots (20+ year old dingos) to any heels I own. Do and wear what makes you feel good.

[youbeyouibei]

Raptor,
Throw the make up away. Dye your hair green and wear whatever the hell you want. I didn't mean fix it as in do things that other people think help. Do things to fix you for yourself. Your family saying those things is not a good place to be. As others have stated, there is compainionship for everyone. My husband and I own a little local hole in the wall bar. There is this girl that comes in, and she is about 4'8 4'10 Max. She is, by far, the life of the place when she comes in. She runs around and goofs off having a great time, she has purple hair, wears boyish clothes and turns every head in our place. She sings karaoke and people love to pick her up randomly. She is freaking awesome. She...sounds a lot like you. If you could get past what the people around you are saying...and I know that's hard.. but surround yourself with positive people. It takes time, but you can build that confidence. Being short is a pain, but it has it's perks. Like asking tall guys to help you reach the top shelf I wish you were close to us. I would love to introduce you to her and take you out with people who won't tell you how you should dress etc.

Oh, and I hate make up. I only wear it maybe 3-4 times a year at most. I prefer my boots (20+ year old dingos) to any heels I own. Do and wear what makes you feel good.

x2 to this, for anyone, Raptor as well. Been there and done that as far as listening to the negativity people can try to force feed you, especially family. I wrote most of mine off and couldn't be happier. Find your fireteam; the people or person who will go to the gates of Hell with you and back, no questions asked, who will share in the filet mignon times and the pork and bean times both and support you the same throughout it. Basically find the people that love you for YOU, family or not and like RoseyReps said, that starts with loving and accepting yourself for who you are & who YOU want to be.

[Raptor]

Raptor,
Throw the make up away. Dye your hair green and wear whatever the hell you want. I didn't mean fix it as in do things that other people think help. Do things to fix you for yourself. Your family saying those things is not a good place to be. As others have stated, there is compainionship for everyone. My husband and I own a little local hole in the wall bar. There is this girl that comes in, and she is about 4'8 4'10 Max. She is, by far, the life of the place when she comes in. She runs around and goofs off having a great time, she has purple hair, wears boyish clothes and turns every head in our place. She sings karaoke and people love to pick her up randomly. She is freaking awesome. She...sounds a lot like you. If you could get past what the people around you are saying...and I know that's hard.. but surround yourself with positive people. It takes time, but you can build that confidence. Being short is a pain, but it has it's perks. Like asking tall guys to help you reach the top shelf I wish you were close to us. I would love to introduce you to her and take you out with people who won't tell you how you should dress etc.

Oh, and I hate make up. I only wear it maybe 3-4 times a year at most. I prefer my boots (20+ year old dingos) to any heels I own. Do and wear what makes you feel good.

I generally wear what I want to, anyway. I just get tired of the crap for it. Parents have been bugging me to get some new shirts since a lot of mine are getting old. So, prior to the new semester, I did. A bunch of tees with graphics on them. The majority were black, but I liked the look of them. Got them home and my step-dad immediately grumbled something about being goth. Your friend sounds nothing like me, actually. While I would dress the same, I wouldn't act like that. I can't stand people I don't know touching me, for one. I'm fairly..Standoffish, I suppose.

x2 to this, for anyone, Raptor as well. Been there and done that as far as listening to the negativity people can try to force feed you, especially family. I wrote most of mine off and couldn't be happier. Find your fireteam; the people or person who will go to the gates of Hell with you and back, no questions asked, who will share in the filet mignon times and the pork and bean times both and support you the same throughout it. Basically find the people that love you for YOU, family or not and like RoseyReps said, that starts with loving and accepting yourself for who you are & who YOU want to be.

Unfortunately, all the people I know that do that are online and out of state. Truthfully, I doubt I'll ever accept/love myself. I never have. Even as a child I didn't like myself, didn't like my name, and I really still don't. It's an uncommon spelling of a common name and almost all my professors/instructors have to ask how to pronounce it. Suffice to say, I've never been a happy person.

[wilomn]

For the record, I do prefer slender women. However, I have seriously dated women who weren't, women who were as tall as I am, 6ft, and veritable midgets, 4'10", heavy and not so much.

A confident woman, size not withstanding, is far more attractive than one who questions her worth based on her looks.

The advice I give my offspring, as well as anyone who wants it, is to totally ignore EVERYONE and make up your own mind about how you feel about yourself.

I'm a bit on the fat side, I work out, am stronger and in better shape than I look and don't give a rat's patootie what anyone else thinks of me. I know I'm a good guy on the inside and were I looking for a steady, it would be important for me to see in someone I wanted a relationship with regardless of whether she was tall, short, heavy, thin or any colour of the rainbow. I may be genetically hardwired to look for certain attributes, but I am also a thinking man who is capable of making my own decisions based solely on my own feelings and totally disregarding what anyone else says I should think.

The standards set by society and the media are a crock. Real women rock. I'll take a real chick over a plasticine model every time.