Considering a Jaguar Jungle Carpet Python

[chet1028]

We are considering a Jag JCP but I'm concerned about the neuro issues. Wondering if anyone has any insights?

[reptileexperts]

Neuro issues are not bad in all specimens. Does the jag gene contain neuro issues? sure . . . but of the 2 jags I have neither show any symptoms at all. I have seen a couple adults that have intenese jagging, but it's going to vary by each snake you encounter. Buy from a reputable breeder and ask about jag syndrome in the parents of the snake and you should get an idea. There are two things you need to know though . . .
1) Stress induces the symptoms.
1a) Chemical stress may also induce - I.e. P.A.M.
2) Jag syndrome will generally stay hidden till a snake hits sexual maturity, around 2 years old. If you buy a hatchling and the owner says it has jagging symptoms. Stay away, it will be even worse later on in it's life.

Hope this helps.

[chet1028]

Thanks for the feedback. I think I'm going to pass on his guy. The breeder just told me that this was his first clutch of Jags and he's never heard of neuro issues with them. I think I'm leaning towards an IJ.

[reptileexperts]

Love me some IJ Jags personally. I breed 87.5% IJ jags 100% Het for Granite. You can not go wrong with IJ no matter what you go with morph wise (Granite, pure, or crossbred into coastal for Jag / Caramel). In a couple more generations I plan to attempt an IJ Granite Caramel Jag

[chet1028]

Thanks. I'm leaning towards a normal IJ. How long do the males get? Do you recommend a baby or maybe a juvi?

[reptileexperts]

You can get either and they will be fine. Babies are pretty nippy by nature, but calm down pretty quick with routine handling (getting them out of the cage or tub is usually the fun part). You can get really nice IJ normals purelines fairly cheap (het granite males go for about $200 shipped with pedigree!). Males can get up to 7' beyond contrary belief. But that being said, most stay around 5' with a girth like that of a nice healthy female ball python pre breeding.

[mainbutter]

A while ago, John Battaglia at Morelia Trophy Club put together a little snippet about jags and the neuro issue, I think he made some revisions after requesting input from the folks over at moreliapythons.com

Here's the snippet from his page about jaguars

Information about neurological deficits noted in jaguar pythons:

Some neurological deficits have been associated with jaguar pythons, a morphological variant of

the coastal carpet python (Morelia spilota mcdowelli sub-species). These deficits can range

from those that are so mild they are essentially non-detectable, to animals that move in a

spinning, back-flipping or corkscrew motion. More subtle effects can include poor

coordination, striking aim, or "righting ability" (keeping their head level when turned over).

The vast majority of jaguar pythons have the milder forms of these deficits, barely noticeable

unless the animal is handled. In the opinion of some breeders, even jaguars that appear totally

normal are a little "less athletic" than most carpet pythons.

These neurological deficits can be present upon hatching, or in some cases, develop years later.

One hypothesis is that the "jaguar gene" is coupled with a vulnerability to neurological problems,

and that these problems do not appear unless the animal undergoes some kind of stress. The

majority of jaguar pythons that develop these effects seem to display them at an early age (less

than a year). In most jaguars, these neurological effects may vary a bit over the lifetime of the

snake, but do not appear to significantly deteriorate over time. They do not appear to effect the

overall health or breeding ability of the jaguar python, nor is their any predictable pattern of

inheritance for progeny that have come from affected sire or dam.

http://www.moreliatrophyclub.com/Jaguars.html

For most of the morelia community, these words are the general opinion that is held.

If that doesn't put you enough at ease to work with jags, nothing will. Basically, if you're cool with spider ball pythons, you should be pretty cool with jags. If you're not willing to risk dead leucies, don't breed a jag to another jag.

Jungle Jags are beautiful. High quality Diamond Jungle Jags (in my preference with more diamond influence than jungle) are even more beautiful

[chet1028]

Thanks. I'm undecided. I love the look of the normal JCP but I like that the IJ is a bit smaller. I think we will do some more research.

[mainbutter]

On carpet pythons:

Be VERY VERRRYYY VERY picky with looks. Shop around, carpet python breeding is all about polygenetic selective breeding, with a few morphs thrown in for variety. An average 88% jungle jaguar is much less attractive than a truly hand-picked top of the line normal coastal (or substitute normal IJ, jungle, diamond, whatever subspecies), and you'll appreciate this tidbit extremely after you stare at carpet python pictures for a year or so.

Don't pick a species based on size. All carpet python adults are manageable, and size is so much more variable from individual to individual than from subspecies to subspecies.

[chet1028]

Thanks so much for the feedback. It is helpful. That is the hard part about trying to order a snake online. I prefer to see it live and interact with it. We have a reptile show coming up in Buffalo in September. Hopefully I can find one there. We have a great reptile store here too. They had a beautiful normal JCP that I should have bought. The price was a tad bit high ($199) and I was still debating. I waited 2 days and went back to get him and he was sold. I will check the reptile show in Sept and if nothing is there then I'll hope the reptile store gets another nice one.