I want to see the Punnet Square for a Killer Bee

[SteveySingle]

I understand that Spider x Pastel=Bumblebee, and that Bumblebee x Pastel=1/8 Killerbee...Can anyone show me the punnet squares leading up to the Killer bee? PLEASE!!! It's driving me crazy. I've drawn umteen squares and can't figure out how you get 1/8 Killerbee.

I used the Geneteics Wizard but it doesn't show me the Genotypes for the animals NOR do I understand how to write Dom, Co-Dom. I do understand recessive...

[WmHrbst]

Give this one a try. http://bhbreptiles.com/main.aspx?Page=MorphWizard

[mainbutter]

Most punnett square problems come from poorly identifying the genotype. Use these:

Spider = Ss, or expanded to Sspp
Pastel = Pp, or expanded to ssPp
Super Pastel = PP, or expanded to ssPP
Bumblebee = SsPp
Killer Bee = SsPP

Normal = sspp

your punnett square should come out fine if you go with SsPp x ssPp for bumblebee x pastel.

[SteveySingle]

That's the same thing I was using..how about if I ask THIS. How do you represent genotypes for co-dom animals?

[mainbutter]

However you want. If you're going to actually use textbook biology to think about reptile genetics, throw away everything that you read at a reptile website, words like "co-dominant" are used absolutely incorrectly.

Typically a recessive trait is giving a lower case and dominant traits are given capital letters.

Since INCOMPLETE DOMINANT (the correct terminology) traits are dominant over "normal" traits, at least in such a manner that the have a distinct phenotype from"normal" traits, I like to use uppercase letters.

So for the pastel locus I like to use P for the pastel allele and p for any "normal" allele that pastel is dominant over.

- - - Updated - - -

Let me ask this, if those were the genotypes you were using, why is your 4x4 punnett square not giving you 2 of 16 squares as possible results for SsPP?

[SteveySingle]

Mainbutter, My last reply was in response to whmbrst post...I hadn't seen yours when I was replying. After reading your first post though, I understand better now...Don't know how you get the "expanded genotype" but it helps whn u put it that way. thanks again

[BHReptiles]

The "expanded genotype" is simply labeling what alleles the snake has. A snake has 2 alleles (one from mom, one from dad) per gene. There are some recessive traits (like albinos) that need to have two recessive alleles in order for that trait to be seen. So for an albino, you would have "aa". Now, for co-dominant genes, they only need 1 allele in order to express that trait. So for something like a spider, it would have to be "Ss" and for a pastel, it would be "Pp". Basically, they have one allele for the gene of interest (spider, pastel, etc. that is represented by the "S" or "P") and one allele that's for the wildtype/normal (the "s" or the "p"). Now, for anything super, it means that they have two alleles of the gene of interest. So for a super pastel, they would be "PP".

Now that you understand how to expand a genotype, let's see how we use it in a punnet square. As stated earlier, you said the pairing was a bumblebee x pastel. The pastel would be ssPp (wild type for the spider gene [not a spider] and it expresses the pastel gene). The bumblebee is both pastel AND spider, so it's SsPp.

I've done the punnet square below. Now, in order to get the things in bold, you basically take each allele and see what it COULD pair with. For example, ONE spider allele can be paired with either a pastel allele or a wild type allele. This gives you the "Sp" or "SP". The second spider allele can also be paired with either a pastel allele or a wild type allele. I just did this for every allele. In short, for the bumblebee, the combination of alleles are: SP, Sp, sP. or sp. The combination of the alleles for the pastel are these: sP, sp, sP, sp. On the punnet square, the allele combinations for the bumblebee is on the left vertical and the pastel on the top horizontal end:

	sP	sp	sP	sp
SP	SsPP Killerbee	SsPp Bumblebee	SsPP Killerbee	SsPp Bumblebee
Sp	SsPp Bumblebee	Sspp Spider	SsPp Bumblebee	Sspp Spider
sP	ssPP Super Pastel	ssPp Pastel	ssPP Super Pastel	ssPp Pastel
sp	ssPp Pastel	sspp Normal	ssPp Pastel	sspp Normal

So, in total, you will have
2/16 = 1/8 chance of a Killerbee
4/16 = 1/4 chance of a Bumblee
2/16 = 1/8 chance of a Spider
2/16 = 1/8 chance of a Super Pastel
4/16 = 1/4 chance of a Pastel
2/16 = 1/8 chance of a Normal

[OhhWatALoser]

to shorten your square, just put down each combination of alleles each parent can give, I represent each locus so nothing is forgotten.

the bumblebee can give spider and pastel, pastel, spider, or normal. The pastel can give either pastel or normal.

	sP	sp
SP	SsPP Killerbee	SsPp Bumblebee
sP	ssPP Super Pastel	ssPp Pastel
Sp	SsPp Bumblebee	Sspp Spider
sp	ssPp Pastel	sspp Normal

Male:	Bumblebee
Female:	Pastel
Percent	Fraction	Traits
12.5%	1/8	Killerbee
12.5%	1/8	Super Pastel
25%	1/4	Bumblebee
25%	1/4	Pastel
12.5%	1/8	Spider
12.5%	1/8	Normal
View Results Page

[SteveySingle]

You guys have been more than helpful, thanks!