BOI or no BOI? That is the question.

[Kodieh]

Yeah, just take your gut at its word and move on. You'll definitely want to keep the name and fauna username down so that if anything comes up with him again or in case you want to search the BOI again later.

Though, me personally, I'm right with you on it. As bad as it is to not want to touch someone with a ten foot pole based on a history or lack there of, dealing in hets is a whole other ball park of risk. And honestly, if he's gonna post it in less than 24 hours then that's a pretty definite stay away sign.


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[PsychD_Student]

No transaction occurred so I am not sure why you would want to post on the BOI.

As far as animal and their availability and being posted elsewhere here is my take on it as long as there is no money exchanged to me the animal is still available for sell (unless it is someone I know will come through with the payment those are generally friends and/or repeat customers).

People cannot hold an animal every time someone say I will get you the money next week. When I hold an animal that mean I received a deposit, no deposit no hold.

Well Northern GA is pretty close to me, and thats where you're from. Let's say we decided today to meet next Tuesday July, 24 2012 somewhere like Chattanooga (about the middle between knox and N. GA) to purchase a BP you needed for a new breeding project. We talked on the phone, decided on the price, deposit, and payment plans. Then the very next day, you saw that I posted on Kingsnake or another classifieds page the exact same animals I was planning to sell you.

You wouldn't care, shrugging it off as just business?

[PsychD_Student]

Yeah, just take your gut at its word and move on. You'll definitely want to keep the name and fauna username down so that if anything comes up with him again or in case you want to search the BOI again later.

Though, me personally, I'm right with you on it. As bad as it is to not want to touch someone with a ten foot pole based on a history or lack there of, dealing in hets is a whole other ball park of risk. And honestly, if he's gonna post it in less than 24 hours then that's a pretty definite stay away sign.


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Thats exactly how I feel about it.

[Stewart_Reptiles]

Well Northern GA is pretty close to me, and thats where you're from. Let's say we decided today to meet next Tuesday July, 24 2012 somewhere like Chattanooga (about the middle between knox and N. GA) to purchase a BP you needed for a new breeding project. We talked on the phone, decided on the price, deposit, and payment plans. Then the very next day, you saw that I posted on Kingsnake or another classifieds page the exact same animals I was planning to sell you.

You wouldn't care, shrugging it off as just business?

If I did not place a deposit within minutes of our conversation via paypal, I could only blame myself if the animal is re-listed.

I generally (again based on whether or not I have done business with the person before) give someone 24 hours to come through with the deposit after that the length of the payment plan is based on the purchase amount. If within 24 hours of the email / phone conversation there is no down payment the animal will show as available again and if someone else purchase the animal in the mean time there is nothing I can do.

Of course there are ways to do this such as a reminder email "this has been 24 hours since our conversation etc" and if you don't hear from the person than you can assume they were not serious to start with.

There are a shady sellers but there are many buyers wasting peoples time also.

Follow your gut find another breeder (there are MANY out there) however I doubt there is a need to waste time on the BOI for a transaction that did not even occur.

[wolfy-hound]

In my opinion, no deposit, no sale. You're out no money. I can't count the number of times I've heard "I'll send money next week... tomorrow... next friday... when I get paid..." and never heard from them again. I've set up meetings with people, gone out to meet them and had them no show. No deposit means no sale has taken place and you could have flaked out on him and never done a deal. It's possible that if someone had inquired on the female pictured, that he would say "I have a pending deal..." too.

And for the record, I've never heard of any sale where the BUYER holds the animals after paying only a deposit. That's the most risky way to do it, since now one person has the money and the animal. I would never ship an animal that is not paid for, and haven't ever seen anyone that would.

This of course, does not include people that have done multiple deals together or know each other for years or business partners.

[jason79]

If I did not place a deposit within minutes of our conversation via paypal, I could only blame myself if the animal is re-listed.

I generally (again based on whether or not I have done business with the person before) give someone 24 hours to come through with the deposit after that the length of the payment plan is based on the purchase amount. If within 24 hours of the email / phone conversation there is no down payment the animal will show as available again and if someone else purchase the animal in the mean time there is nothing I can do.

Of course there are ways to do this such as a reminder email "this has been 24 hours since our conversation etc" and if you don't hear from the person than you can assume they were not serious to start with.

There are a shady sellers but there are many buyers wasting peoples time also.

Follow your gut find another breeder (there are MANY out there) however I doubt there is a need to waste time on the BOI for a transaction that did not even occur.

I agree with this completely. He was also asking the seller to drive and meet him so he could take possession of the snakes while only paying a deposit and I bet he talked him down on the price too. The seller must really need them gone to take such a deal. Not that I would ever allow any animal to leave my possession before it was paid in full but if I did I would try my best to sell it to someone else that would pay in full before he made his deposit so I didn’t have to make that deal. Until money changes hands there is no deal. People do act interested and waste your time and then disappear all the time if you hold something for them you will miss out on sales to others.

[PsychD_Student]

I completely understand where you guys are coming from on the idea that people can and will waste a seller's time. However, the buyer never asked me to send a deposit. We agreed to meet the following week, I would give him a deposit and one of the snakes. When I paid off the other ones (which would have been about 2 or 3 weeks later) I would get those. That seemed legit.

I guess if the seller mentions or requests the deposit be made, thats different. For example, because this deal didn't go through, I am purchasing a couple het ultramels from a pretty well known breeder for a different project. I completely trust this individual from all the amazing positive BOI posts and feedback. He asked for a deposit, and I immediately sent it on paypal once I got the invoice.

At the time the other guy and I discussed the deal, I didn't have any reason to feel weird. Yeah, he isn't known at all on the BOI, but after speaking with him, I felt alright. If he would have asked for the deposit at that time, I would have sent it via paypal. If you are going by this 24 hour rule, then you should ask for a deposit. If not, I assumed the deposit at time of getting the first snake would be fine.

[PsychD_Student]

I agree with this completely. He was also asking the seller to drive and meet him so he could take possession of the snakes while only paying a deposit and I bet he talked him down on the price too. The seller must really need them gone to take such a deal. Not that I would ever allow any animal to leave my possession before it was paid in full but if I did I would try my best to sell it to someone else that would pay in full before he made his deposit so I didn’t have to make that deal. Until money changes hands there is no deal. People do act interested and waste your time and then disappear all the time if you hold something for them you will miss out on sales to others.

I feel like there is some insinuation here that I was doing something shady, assuming how things went in the deal. Let me break it down for you before you get going down the wrong direction.

1. I actually agreed to the price HE set for the animals, which was market value. I saw similar prices on KS.com that week. So you're wrong.

2. He offered to drive and meet ME. I actually offered to drive and meet him somewhere in his local city. So don't try it.

Not that I would ever allow any animal to leave my possession before it was paid in full but if I did I would try my best to sell it to someone else that would pay in full before he made his deposit so I didn’t have to make that deal.

Uh... That really some shiesty stuff. If you have a problem with doing any payment plans, then dont make a deal to do one. I've never done one until this one I tried to do because I've never had to. He contacted me after I'd already bought other animals, and he offered to do it when I replied that I couldn't afford to purchase the animal in full for a couple weeks. I even said, I hope you have it on August 1st! Then he mentioned he had another couple females (that were in the same post), and we could make a deal for all three. I'm actually not saying its a bad thing to do a payment plan at all, just never did it before.

So relax man... no reason to come out swinging when you don't even know what you're swinging at.

[Kodieh]

Anyway, we decided on a deal for the animals, and I was happy with the risk involved. We talked by phone about the trade, because I was a bit hesitant to make installment payments for the snakes with someone who had NO history online if I didn't get the animals AT time of deposit. I offered info about my place of work and references. He was hesitant, and we worked out a deal that made us both happy.

This is where people are getting bent backward about. You made the statement that it would make you feel better to have the animals with the first installment of the payment plan.

Generally considered a no no, but I understand that it was a metaphor of sorts to go with the gut feeling you had.


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[jason79]

I'm not the one who was going to start a BOI post about a deal that never happened.