Temperature Question

[kitedemon]

The point remains that different wattages run different temps no I don't believe and one here has a Holroyd Matts it is too bad they don't make low wattage stuff. (water proof, silicone rubber mat, fire resistant ? I would buy them if they did.) Exo terra sells two wattages one low one high for example (in the exact same sizes). The case remains there are hundreds of heat mats. Hell, I have one that needs no regulation and could be placed inside safely (max temp is 84º waterproof and abrasion proof) do I run around suggesting such a thing NO. (don't place heat mats inside or unregulated)

That is the point. Recommending something that not using exactly the same as you are in the same conditions you are, that could cause an animal harm is not a good idea.

Please before you post advise think about if the advise is based on something that is general or specific to a single set up and single product! If it is maybe not post it or with qualifiers. State the conditions under how it has worked for you. Advising a new person to do something that has the potential to seriously harm their animal, without telling what conditions need to be in place at the same time.

I shot you down so hard because currently I have a rehab snake in that is suffering because someone told the owner that it was not necessary to use a thermostat with a heating mat and a tub. The poor kid (the guy is 12) got a bit of 11 inch flexwatt and wired it and plugged it in and dropped the tub on top of it. Cooked snake. It sucks the kid is heart broken and traumatized. Should he have read care sheets carefully yes, did he no. He listened to some random person on a forum and the advise he got burned his snake. One person told him flexwatt was best and someone else said uths could be run un regulated together they make a disaster. The snake has second degree burns. The organization I work with is helping with the rehab and treatment. Which form and poster I did not ask, could it have been here? Yes it could have.

[KMG]

I understand that a good percentage of people don't take proper care of their animals or themselves for that matter. That's how I got my BP.

I think you and I are fighting for the same cause. I think I'm giving people to much credit in the common sense department. It should probably be said to NEVER place your animal in any enclosure until you have it setup and tested. I knew the hazards of over heating my snakes and set the tanks up and made sure all was well before introducing them into it. Although out of all the care sheets I have read I have never seen that advise I just used my own brain and figured that was the safest way.

You and I could go back and forth all day but I really don't want to. What you forum veterans need to do is give more detailed advise. I have noticed that many times a new snake owner will ask a question and they will get short answers that really didn't answer the question. Sometimes it seems they are just posting to get their post number up.

Again my post was not meant as a how to guide and I was in no way trying to get anybody to try my setup. I saw a person that was having a similar problem that I had before and commented on what I did to get it solved. Like I suggested, I guess I left out some details or qualifiers. 1. I am using a low power uth, not a mega uth. 2. Remove your snake while you experiment with your heating equipment. After all a over powered heat lamp set on the tank screen can cook your pet as well. Which is how it seems you see people using the lamps. I personally use the purpose built heat lamp stands and love them. They provide a good standoff and they are still delivering heat with the screen off while I take my BP out to handle or perform maintenance.

This whole time I was in the mind set that the animal was removed from the tank and we were testing the created the environment. Why didn't one of you tell them not to have their pet in the tank during setup. Am I weird by removing mine? I don't want any animal hurt!

Now that I have one and see the usefulness of it my first recommendation is buy a IR temp gun. Makes you habitat much more accurate.

[martin82531]

If you have the thermostat probe sitting on the bottom of your tank over the uth you need to remember the temp on the substrate will be alittle lower. Depending on what you use the temp maybe much lower. Check the substrate surface temp with a IR themometer.

Currently I have the have the probe from the hydrometer sitting inside the tank directly over the UTH. I used a hot glue gun to keep the probe in place, the substrate (Aspen) is sitting on top of the probe. Any thoughts on this?

Also do you have any recommendations on an IR temp gun?

[KMG]

I use this IR gun, so far it has worked great.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...ls_o03_s00_i00

You typed hydrometer but I think you are asking about your Hydrofarm Tstat probe. It sounds like it is located in the right spot. Like others have stated the differences in uth is great. Depending on yours I would be worried that the glue might melt and make a mess or ruin your probe. The substrate should anchor your probe fine. If you want an anchor you could get a fake silk plant from any pet store to hang from your tank wall to house the wire and give it some support. They just use a suction cup to stick to the side and stand up well to critters. They also hold water after misting helping your humidity and give your snake a place to drink from. Mine will often drink from the leaves in the tank.

just remember that the thickness, type, moistness or dryness of your substrate will make your surface temp higher or lower than what the uth is set at. Thats where the temp gun comes into play to get it right.

Tip: for more support of the wire you could use zip ties to anchor the wire all the way down the plant branch. I would use a lighter to soften (round off the sharp points) the edges after you snip of the tails. Just kiss the sharp corners with a lighter and rub them with your fingers. I bet the edges wouldn't hurt your snake, but better safe than sorry. This may be overdone, my snakes don't pay my wires any attention.

DO NOT USE TAPE WITHIN YOUR TANK.

[kitedemon]

It is likely you will have micro climates in your tank especially for humidity. I like to place hygrometer probes in the warm and cool hides. It is very common to have the arm one lower than the cool.

IR guns are great tools. The basic models are very similar accuracy (+/-2ºF) so the differences are the DS ratio and the batteries it takes. I would recommend one that takes a common battery (9v is common for them I avoid the ones that take things like sr44 I had one years ago that took six sr44 at 7$ a battery... )
DS ratio for royals 1:1 is the best likely they have an optimal measurement distance of around 4 inches. The 6:1 are about 24inches and that seems a bit much for royals.

[martin82531]

I use this IR gun, so far it has worked great.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...ls_o03_s00_i00

You typed hydrometer but I think you are asking about your Hydrofarm Tstat probe. It sounds like it is located in the right spot. Like others have stated the differences in uth is great. Depending on yours I would be worried that the glue might melt and make a mess or ruin your probe. The substrate should anchor your probe fine. If you want an anchor you could get a fake silk plant from any pet store to hang from your tank wall to house the wire and give it some support. They just use a suction cup to stick to the side and stand up well to critters. They also hold water after misting helping your humidity and give your snake a place to drink from. Mine will often drink from the leaves in the tank.

just remember that the thickness, type, moistness or dryness of your substrate will make your surface temp higher or lower than what the uth is set at. Thats where the temp gun comes into play to get it right.

Tip: for more support of the wire you could use zip ties to anchor the wire all the way down the plant branch. I would use a lighter to soften (round off the sharp points) the edges after you snip of the tails. Just kiss the sharp corners with a lighter and rub them with your fingers. I bet the edges wouldn't hurt your snake, but better safe than sorry. This may be overdone, my snakes don't pay my wires any attention.

DO NOT USE TAPE WITHIN YOUR TANK.

You are correct, I meant to say my hydrofarm probe. I think I'm going to pick up a IR gun to help get a better accurate reading of the temperature in the cage. I think I'm ok now, but if I can fine tune the snakes environment, that will be better for the snake.

Reading the ball python care guide on the forums, it says the basking area should be between 88-94 degrees. In a hypothetical situation, if the temperature stays in this range but is consistently fluxuating in this temperature range, is this bad for the snake, and if so, how come?

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[KMG]

I wouldn't say its bad. However a few degrees for us is a bigger deal for a snake. If your tank changes temp a bit that's fine as long as its within their good range. I would make sure to have a constant basking area though. Its easy for your snake to move to a cooler zone but if it doesn't have a basking zone when it needs it, it can't create it for itself. Try to make sure to keep that constant. I Use a ceramic heater on a stand. That way I can lower or raise it to get the desired temp and I can make it directional. Tip: use the purpose built wire lamp not a regular heat lamp dome. The heater states using the wrong fixture will cause it to burn out.

Also Serpantmerchant says he uses hot glue to secure his probe. I would test it though.

[kitedemon]

I use hot melt for securing T-stat probes personally I don't secure thermometer probes but hot melt is great. The two points with it. Remove the snake while you are gluing! The second is I would suggest securing all the wire down that is inside. It really sucks to find a snake tangled in a cord. With the cord stuck at the probe and where the access is tangles can happen. I had one ages ago my big girl just tore the cable apart so no harm. It would suck if you use an expensive thermometer like a accurite.