Do you believe in Ghosts?

[Egapal]

what else would it be, this gaseous alien? i mean yes it could be, except i cant imagine an alien made out of gas looking just like a human. besides, whats the point of you coming and ressurecting a thread that nobodys ben talking on for a few days now, just to argue with what everyone else says or believes? stating your opinion is one thing, but replying to every individuals post and outright attacking it, basically saying that we know nothing were talking about, and that were ignorant for believing in such things, is just rude.

I don't see how your being able to imagine it makes it more likely to be true. The point is when you see something you should pull from other things you know to be true when you speculate as to what that thing might be. You should not speculate based on movies, books, or ghost stories that have never been proven to even exist. I am sorry I don't get a chance to read the forum every day. When I get a chance I come on and comment regardless of the age of the thread. I am not arguing with what everyone says. I am making posts specifically to what I consider to be wild claims. I am sorry if you think my comments are rude. The posts that I commented on show for themselves that they don't know facts that support their beliefs. If you believe things without facts I would call you ignorant when it comes to those beliefs. I am certainly not trying to assault anyone's character. I am ignorant when it comes to simple combustion engines that cover the world we live in. I don't go around making claims about how they work and I would suspect if I did someone would point out that I am in fact ignorant on that subject.

[Egapal]

i just want to say this. Albert Einstein said that everything has energy, even human beings. And "Energy can not be destroyed or created, it can only be transferred". That being said if people die, there can be such things as ghosts or entities that we can't see.

You are using that statement out of context to support a claim you have. The law of thermo dynamics does not postulate ghosts. When you shut of your TV is there a TV ghost? When your car stalls, is there a car ghost? Do flies have ghosts, what about fish or ants? I suspect that the reason you believe in Ghosts has very little to do with energy and a lot to do with your elevation of the mind of humans to supernatural status. Unless you can prove something about the mind that you haven't already I don't see any reason to even conjecture that the energy you have when you are alive would continue on as a ghost. The act of dying is the act of the cells dying, they stop producing energy, and the energy dissipating. The bulk of the "energy" of a human body is the flesh which could be eaten by another animal to sustain its life. The small amount of electrical charge dissipates with out the biological functions to support it. Do this experiment. Go out and buy a new battery. Leave it in a drawer in your house for 10 years. After the long wait put the battery in something and see how well it works. Where did all the energy go? Should we assume there is a battery ghost haunting your drawer?

[j_h_smith]

You can have whatever belief you want, but don't discount other's experiences. After my sister's house experience, you can't tell me there's no such things as ghosts. Hearing something walk up and down the steps when no one actually is, hearing toe curling screams in the same room where you are eating, seeing people that you know aren't there, having something touch you while you're watching TV, have things move that you know you haven't touched. These things happend to my family. You can keep believing whatever you want. Your reality is what you perceive.

[Egapal]

You can have whatever belief you want, but don't discount other's experiences. After my sister's house experience, you can't tell me there's no such things as ghosts. Hearing something walk up and down the steps when no one actually is, hearing toe curling screams in the same room where you are eating, seeing people that you know aren't there, having something touch you while you're watching TV, have things move that you know you haven't touched. These things happend to my family. You can keep believing whatever you want. Your reality is what you perceive.

I am certainly not discounting other's experiences. I am not disputing that you and your family had experiences. I am discounting the conclusions you are drawing from those experiences. Despite what you may think reality is NOT what you perceive. There is such a thing as reality irrespective of our perceptions. There are a host of explanations that are far more likely that ghosts. Again I am not passing judgment on you or your family. Beliefs can be perfectly reasonable and still be wrong. As a child for a short period of time I believed in Santa Clause. The existence of Santa was supported by the fact that presents showed up and after all, my parents wouldn't lie. As it turned out I was wrong and what seamed pretty far fetched at the time (my parents were playing Santa) turned out to be true. I am not trying to equate your beliefs to that of believing in Santa or your mentality to that of a child. Let me present some alternatives that are more likely than ghosts. Group hallucinations. Perhaps someone was playing an elaborate hoax or con on you and your family to try and get you out of the house. I am not saying that either of these things is likely only that they are far more likely than ghosts which have never been able to be proved to even exist in stark contrast to the very real accounts and explanations and studies of group hallucinations and the reality of human greed.

[j_h_smith]

I am certainly not discounting other's experiences. I am not disputing that you and your family had experiences. I am discounting the conclusions you are drawing from those experiences. Despite what you may think reality is NOT what you perceive. There is such a thing as reality irrespective of our perceptions. There are a host of explanations that are far more likely that ghosts. Again I am not passing judgment on you or your family. Beliefs can be perfectly reasonable and still be wrong. As a child for a short period of time I believed in Santa Clause. The existence of Santa was supported by the fact that presents showed up and after all, my parents wouldn't lie. As it turned out I was wrong and what seamed pretty far fetched at the time (my parents were playing Santa) turned out to be true. I am not trying to equate your beliefs to that of believing in Santa or your mentality to that of a child. Let me present some alternatives that are more likely than ghosts. Group hallucinations. Perhaps someone was playing an elaborate hoax or con on you and your family to try and get you out of the house. I am not saying that either of these things is likely only that they are far more likely than ghosts which have never been able to be proved to even exist in stark contrast to the very real accounts and explanations and studies of group hallucinations and the reality of human greed.

Wow, you want me to bellieve that my family suffered from group hallucinations, and just who would have been playing a "joke" on my family. My sister left this house after breaking the lease and losing months of rent money to do so. BTW, the house had been rented to others and as far as we can determine, no one ever stayed more than 4 months.

Just because you don't believe in something doesn't make it unreal. You can play the doubting Thomas if you'd like, but there are far too many things that happened in this house for me to believe otherwise.

How can you try to judge something when you don't really know anything about this particular subject. Stop watching TV and do some analysis of facts.

[Egapal]

Wow, you want me to bellieve that my family suffered from group hallucinations, and just who would have been playing a "joke" on my family. My sister left this house after breaking the lease and losing months of rent money to do so. BTW, the house had been rented to others and as far as we can determine, no one ever stayed more than 4 months.

I don't want you to believe anything. I am simply presenting possibilities that you seam to have completely discounted in favor of something far less likely. I don't know who would have been playing a joke, but the land lord could have been conning you. You just admitted your sister lost a months rent. Sounds like the landlord is making money on these ghosts. Are you saying that a supernatural ghost is the only answer? Its way more likely that ghost exist than a greedy land lord doing some despicable things.

Just because you don't believe in something doesn't make it unreal. You can play the doubting Thomas if you'd like, but there are far too many things that happened in this house for me to believe otherwise.

Likewise just because you believe in something doesn't make it real. You can believe what you like but you have not presented any evidence that would make me believe.

How can you try to judge something when you don't really know anything about this particular subject. Stop watching TV and do some analysis of facts.

I am not sure where you get that I watch too much TV but I am trying to analyze the facts. You have presented none that lead me to believe you experienced a ghost. I know enough about the particular subject to judge. If I have read a considerable amount about how ghosts don't show up under testable conditions and how a healthy human mind can come to the conclusion ghosts exist despite the lack of real evidence.

[j_h_smith]

I don't want you to believe anything. I am simply presenting possibilities that you seam to have completely discounted in favor of something far less likely. I don't know who would have been playing a joke, but the land lord could have been conning you. You just admitted your sister lost a months rent. Sounds like the landlord is making money on these ghosts. Are you saying that a supernatural ghost is the only answer? Its way more likely that ghost exist than a greedy land lord doing some despicable things.



Likewise just because you believe in something doesn't make it real. You can believe what you like but you have not presented any evidence that would make me believe.



I am not sure where you get that I watch too much TV but I am trying to analyze the facts. You have presented none that lead me to believe you experienced a ghost. I know enough about the particular subject to judge. If I have read a considerable amount about how ghosts don't show up under testable conditions and how a healthy human mind can come to the conclusion ghosts exist despite the lack of real evidence.

This was 1970, how do you think the landlord made doors open and close with a bang? How did he throw knicknacks across the room, how did he do any number of others things. 1970, not much of a chance electronics came into play. Yes, I'm telling you that we're not back yard bumkins. My family checked oout all kind of possiblilites. Far too many of the extended family witnessed this things.
I'm not trying to make you believe, but why do come on here telling me that what my family experienced has to have some other explanation? Group hullucienations. Now doesn't that sound like some far reach conjecture? I don't see where that even comes close to human interaction with whatever was in this house.

How can you honestly say you can analyze any information presented here when you obviously have a leaning against any of these reports. Open up you mind and look at this objectively, not with your slant.

What makes you the authority to JUDGE (your words not miine) my family's experience in 1970. The mind can play tricks, but there was physical evidence.

This is one reason why I haven't been around this forum for some time. There are so many experts here, I can't imagine how the world existed before you all were born.

You sir are no expert in this subject, so stop playing the part.

[Egapal]

This was 1970, how do you think the landlord made doors open and close with a bang? How did he throw knicknacks across the room, how did he do any number of others things. 1970, not much of a chance electronics came into play. Yes, I'm telling you that we're not back yard bumkins. My family checked oout all kind of possiblilites. Far too many of the extended family witnessed this things.
I'm not trying to make you believe, but why do come on here telling me that what my family experienced has to have some other explanation? Group hullucienations. Now doesn't that sound like some far reach conjecture? I don't see where that even comes close to human interaction with whatever was in this house.

How can you honestly say you can analyze any information presented here when you obviously have a leaning against any of these reports. Open up you mind and look at this objectively, not with your slant.

What makes you the authority to JUDGE (your words not miine) my family's experience in 1970. The mind can play tricks, but there was physical evidence.

This is one reason why I haven't been around this forum for some time. There are so many experts here, I can't imagine how the world existed before you all were born.

You sir are no expert in this subject, so stop playing the part.

You are severely missing my point. You are asking me to believe in something supernatural for which there has never any reliable, repeatable, peer reviewed evidence for. I have seen first hand the wonder of what science has been able to achieve. In this case I consider the lack of evidence to be evidence which we can reasonably due when evidence should be present. Literally any natural explanation is more likely since supernatural things have not been proven to exist. I would sooner except that fairies or aliens were behind your experiences. I am not making a joke here. I would much sooner accept that aliens or fairies did it. As both are at least possible given what I know about the universe. I am not claiming any ultimate knowledge. The world did and does do fine without me. It would not have gotten to the place we are today if people had continued to believe supernatural reasons for the things that occur in nature. Advances have and do come when people reject supernatural explanations for lack of evidence and search out and follow the evidence. You asked me to open my mind. I am doing just that. I am open to a whole host of possible explanations with ghosts at the bottom do to their supernatural nature. You have rejected all possible explanations in favor of the first thing that made since based on ghost stories. For the record magicians have been performing illusions for centuries. You don't need electronics to fake a ghost. I implore you to take your own advice. Look at this objectively. With that I am out. If you want to continue you can message me privately. If you respond to this post I will respond to your privately.

[wilomn]

Hey pal, why are you so all fired sure that only you have the answer to any question anyone asks?

Why are you such a bummer? Why are you so negative? Why are you such a downer?

What makes you think anyone wants to hear you spout off about how you know this and you know that and why people are wrong for not believing the same things you do?

You ain't the be all and end all of anything. You're just another schmuck on another website with another opinion. You do have one fine wall up though, got to give you that. It absodamnlutely prevents anything from getting in that you don't 100% approve of.

Kindof a crappy way to view life in my opinion, but then I appreciate mystery more than a little. I'm not sure you even admit mystery exists. Or that anything mysterious exists.

Not everything has a reason. Not everything has a cause. No matter how much you want or need to believe otherwise, those two truths remain.

[cmack91]

I don't see how your being able to imagine it makes it more likely to be true. The point is when you see something you should pull from other things you know to be true when you speculate as to what that thing might be. You should not speculate based on movies, books, or ghost stories that have never been proven to even exist. I am sorry I don't get a chance to read the forum every day. When I get a chance I come on and comment regardless of the age of the thread. I am not arguing with what everyone says. I am making posts specifically to what I consider to be wild claims. I am sorry if you think my comments are rude. The posts that I commented on show for themselves that they don't know facts that support their beliefs. If you believe things without facts I would call you ignorant when it comes to those beliefs. I am certainly not trying to assault anyone's character. I am ignorant when it comes to simple combustion engines that cover the world we live in. I don't go around making claims about how they work and I would suspect if I did someone would point out that I am in fact ignorant on that subject.

okay, well this is what happened with me, we'll see what your opinion is on this:

my grandma has this chair in her living room, its an old chair, its tall wide, and thin, with a compartment under the seat, the seat lifts up like a trunk. she used to keep two dolls in it and a couple more on top. EVERY night, the lid to the storage compartment would throw itself open, and slam itself shut again, knocking the dolls that were on top to the ground. it always did this between 2 and 5 a.m. constantly. we all have walked into that room and watch it do this. no assisstance from anyone, or anything, no animals in the house, no room for my grandpa or anyone else to sit behind it pulling a string to scare us, no electronic mechanisms or anything like that, just wood, and hinges from the late18's to early 1900's. simple stuff. it did this for more than five years straight, until my grandma finally got rid of the dolls. she still has the chair, and it doesnt make a noise.

second experience:
i was at my dads old house, probably 14-15, maybe 16. anyways, i was sitting around, watching tv, at around 10-10:30P.m. i wasnt watching any scary movies, i wasnt thinking about ghosts or anything like that. so i get tired and go upstairs to go to bed. when i walk in my room, i turned my light on, and in the middle of the room was a girl hanging by a rope. clear as day. couldnt see through her, i was able to move and she kept her same spot in the room, she moved with me (and by this i mean that when i moved right, she moved left in my feild of view, and the rope stayed in the same spot on the ceiling), so i knew it wasnt my eyes playing tricks on me. after a good minute of staring at her, a power fuse blew, and shut everything off up stairs. and by this point i was pretty much terrified, and im not the kind of person that starts freaking out when im scared, im always able to stay calm and keep my mind collected, i wasnt just already scared and making it up in my mind. i ran downstairs, flipped the fuse on, went back upstairs, and the girl was gone. no trace of her. a few months later we discover that the first people to live there, had a teenage daughter, in the room mine was in, and she killed herself by hanging from the ceiling.

so what are your explanations for these two experiences? and dont just say, "well i dont have to give you an explanation becaus eyour most likely making it up" or any other excuses. tell me what would cause these things to occur naturally, please