Ball python that thinks its a tree snake! :)

[anatess]

I'm not sure I would agree that "they climb because they like to". I'm more into the thinking of "they climb because they want to get out".

I believe that a hiding bp is a content and safe bp. An exploring bp... is either stressed out/hungry/looking for the escape route.

I completely believe that tubs are better for bp's than tanks because there's not as much stuff to mess up on. I have maintained 4 decked-out display tanks for 2 years and I've gotten it down to a science. It is hard work. Now that we have 7 bp's... I can't maintain them all. So, I'm keeping the 3 babies in their tubs until I figure out a better alternative.

Below is an image of my stressed bp on a tree. She was our first snake and the store owner said she'll do well in the giant exo-terra tank... cost me an arm and a leg but I thought it was what they needed! That was before I learned what ball pythons are. The snake was constantly climbing the tree trying to get out. She was a finicky eater, shed in pieces, very nervous (goes into strike mode at the drop of a hat). I finally moved her to a 20gallon long and she was a much calmer snake then. Never climbed the tree since. She started eating like clockwork. The kids love handling her - she was very docile after we got her all situated properly. And yes, we don't see her much in the tank anymore. She stays hiding majority of the time.



Stressed out strike mode!


If you check out my avatar, that's my other snake in a 20gallon climbing his tree. That was his first day in that enclosure. He climbed the tree for the first 2 days and then settled down after that - you rarely see him then. He's either in his hide or crossing to the floor to get a drink or move to the other hide. That's the only time you see him. He is now in a 30gallon and still, you rarely see him. My kids handle him almost everyday, but once he is back in his enclosure, he is back in his hide. So really, that 30 gallon space is nothing but eye-candy for me. Sure not doing that bp much difference.

Anyway, that's just my experience from my tree-climbers in my meager 2 years of owning snakes.

[ms381]

I'm not sure I would agree that "they climb because they like to". I'm more into the thinking of "they climb because they want to get out".

I believe that a hiding bp is a content and safe bp. An exploring bp... is either stressed out/hungry/looking for the escape route.

I completely believe that tubs are better for bp's than tanks because there's not as much stuff to mess up on. I have maintained 4 decked-out display tanks for 2 years and I've gotten it down to a science. It is hard work. Now that we have 7 bp's... I can't maintain them all. So, I'm keeping the 3 babies in their tubs until I figure out a better alternative.

Below is an image of my stressed bp on a tree. She was our first snake and the store owner said she'll do well in the giant exo-terra tank... cost me an arm and a leg but I thought it was what they needed! That was before I learned what ball pythons are. The snake was constantly climbing the tree trying to get out. She was a finicky eater, shed in pieces, very nervous (goes into strike mode at the drop of a hat). I finally moved her to a 20gallon long and she was a much calmer snake then. Never climbed the tree since. She started eating like clockwork. The kids love handling her - she was very docile after we got her all situated properly. And yes, we don't see her much in the tank anymore. She stays hiding majority of the time.



Stressed out strike mode!


If you check out my avatar, that's my other snake in a 20gallon climbing his tree. That was his first day in that enclosure. He climbed the tree for the first 2 days and then settled down after that - you rarely see him then. He's either in his hide or crossing to the floor to get a drink or move to the other hide. That's the only time you see him. He is now in a 30gallon and still, you rarely see him. My kids handle him almost everyday, but once he is back in his enclosure, he is back in his hide. So really, that 30 gallon space is nothing but eye-candy for me. Sure not doing that bp much difference.

Anyway, that's just my experience from my tree-climbers in my meager 2 years of owning snakes.

The picture of the stressed snake is really interesting to me. This is my first snake and although i researched ball pythons for a year, nothing compares to owning one.

So going back to the picture, when i saw mine at the top of my tank (mentioned in the first comment) this was his posistion?

I will just clear up some things and then hope you can advise on whats best.

My tank is large BUT have made it smaller, hence the use of the exo terra fake wall which he climbs up to. Its 60 cm w and about 30 cm wide, maybe a bit to large but i have covered alot of his vision so he wont feel to stressed (hopefully).

I have two hides, 1 cool 1 warm and a small log thing that acts as a hide in the middle, i aslo have fake plants that i assume his using also to get to the top of the wall.

One question: do you think i should remove the wall and plants so theres no chance to get up there?

One comment: Im offering alot of hidding space for him so the options are there to hide if his stressed or feels threatend, so i assumed him going up there and being active was a good sign. However seeing your picture, thats how he was when at the top?

Edit: He only goes to the top of the cage at night (apart from the first introduction to the cage), last two days his been tucked up his warm hide during the day and most of the night.

[anatess]

The picture of the stressed snake is really interesting to me. This is my first snake and although i researched ball pythons for a year, nothing compares to owning one.

So going back to the picture, when i saw mine at the top of my tank (mentioned in the first comment) this was his posistion?

I will just clear up some things and then hope you can advise on whats best.

My tank is large BUT have made it smaller, hence the use of the exo terra fake wall which he climbs up to. Its 60 cm w and about 30 cm wide, maybe a bit to large but i have covered alot of his vision so he wont feel to stressed (hopefully).

I have two hides, 1 cool 1 warm and a small log thing that acts as a hide in the middle, i aslo have fake plants that i assume his using also to get to the top of the wall.

One question: do you think i should remove the wall and plants so theres no chance to get up there?

One comment: Im offering alot of hidding space for him so the options are there to hide if his stressed or feels threatend, so i assumed him going up there and being active was a good sign. However seeing your picture, thats how he was when at the top?

Edit: He only goes to the top of the cage at night (apart from the first introduction to the cage), last two days his been tucked up his warm hide during the day and most of the night.

Yeah, hiding during the day is what they do. They come out at night... usually when everybody is already asleep. I just know they do because I've spent many sleepless nights just sitting in the office where the tanks are just waiting for them to come out. The first few weeks we had them, they're cruising all over the place, climbing up the glass wall. Have you ever seen them climb up the glass wall and only 1/4 of their body is left on the ground? Then after a minute or two you hear the big "FLOP" when they can't hold themselves up anymore? Yeah, mine do that when you move them to a new tank. It freaks them out. It takes them a while to settle back in.

They try to climb up after cruising the entire perimeter of the tank looking for a weak spot. When they get on that tree, they can stretch their necks out and feel the screen up top and I guess they instinctively realize it is the weakest spot. So, they go up there over and over as much as they can to find a way out. I've seen my first 2 snakes do this the first week. That pastel snake I showed you a picture of actually successfully popped the screen top of that exo-terra tank. That's one of the reasons I moved the snake to a Zilla one with the slide-out screen top. They can't pop that one up.

My snakes still explore their tanks, but I haven't seen any of them climb anymore. I rarely see them roam - they do their exploring at night. But, I know they haven't climbed the tree because the leaves are still on it. When they climb the tree all the leaves gets pushed out of the way and I have to re-arrange them in the morning.

The strike-mode is an instinctive defense pose. If my snakes are not stressed, they would pull their head under their coils when they're startled. If they're stressed (shedding, new move, etc.), they go immediately on strike mode. When they're climbing on a tree - or even when they're just getting used to being handled, they are not as secure as if they're on the ground. So, their instinct is to go on that strike pose.

Each of my snakes are different from each other. My 3rd snake, I already had lots of experience when I got her. So, when she went into her tank for the first time, I knew to put her on a 10 gallon all decked out with hardly any "air space". She still had a tree that hovered above the water bowl to provide a little security when she's drinking. I never saw her climb that tree. I didn't see her climb the walls of the tank either. But, she would slither in and out of tree trunk on the ground, slither around the water bowl and the 2 hides to check them out on her first week - day and night. It could very well be that she's just not the climber type. But, the previous owner told me she's a nervous snake and hasn't eaten in over 3 months before I got her (I got her for cheap because of that - she's an albino). I fed her a week after I got her and she ate within seconds and has been eating consistently since. So, I don't know. I like to believe that the tank set-up gave her a secure environment that she easily adjusted to.



My kids handle the snakes almost daily (too much, if you ask me) when they get home from school. So, that's around 3PM or so. The snakes just got used to it now, I guess because that's when they do a lot of their tongue-flicking, periscoping, curiousity thing. Either that, or they just stay in a ball the whole time sleeping or what-not.

Yes, in the wild, they explore... but that's mainly to find food and water. Since we're handing them their food and their water in our own little set-ups, there's really not much incentive for them to explore about.

[loonunit]

I'm not sure I would agree that "they climb because they like to". I'm more into the thinking of "they climb because they want to get out".

I believe that a hiding bp is a content and safe bp. An exploring bp... is either stressed out/hungry/looking for the escape route.

No, mine climb because they like to. I've only had them 2 years, but I have a dozen of them. If you put them on a bookshelf, some will go up, and some will go down. They don't always go the same way every time, but the same snakes will tend to climb up time after time. And I have one or two that are actually surprisingly good at it.

And the one time I had a mass escape (the lock on my Black Sand tank was broken, and the black pastel girl figured out how to slide open the screen) they all did exactly what they usually do: The black pastel climbed the buffet in the other room and went cruising through our booze collection, and my 2007 girl who likes to climb ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING actually climbed out of her tank, CLIMBED THE STAIRS, and then started climbing bookshelves up there.

And my pied female, who's competing for the World's Laziest Snake, stayed in her hide the whole time.

[loonunit]

Also, I wonder if exercise maybe isn't something we should think about more. Sure they spend 22 hours a day hiding, and they need that to be happy, but they do come out in the middle of the night and cruise. On days 4-7 (if I feed on day 1) they usually cruise quite a bit.

I've heard that corn snake females need exercise to avoid becoming egg bound. But we're mostly interested in the size of our ball python girls, not their musculature. Sometimes I wonder if that's a mistake.

I also wonder iif some of the things we believe are "good" for ball pythons aren't because they're the most convenient for us. It's pretty much impossible to maintain a collection larger than 20 snakes without using tubs, right? And once they're safely in the tubs, and we don't visit them every day, we don't really notice that they're all coming out and moving around for 2 hours every night.

[[]$(@R]

And my pied female, who's competing for the World's Laziest Snake, stayed in her hide the whole time.

AWESOME LOL my girl does this



and it scares the crap outa me its a good 8 or 9 inch drop from there