Help Feeding a Juvenile

[Farnsworth]

Ok guys. I need some help feeding my 10 year old son's juvenile captive bred BP. Bought him at the local pet store 2 and 1/2 weeks ago. Pet store said he ate fuzzy mice twice when fed in a paper bag and they recommended I feed outside the enclosure in a bag or shoe box so the snake won't be prone to biting inside his enclosure. The day we picked the snake up was his normal feeding day at the store so they put him in a bag with a mouse for about 20 minutes before we left, but snake did not eat. Guy said not to worry since the snake was probably stressed since my son had just handled his new pet. Brought snake home, set up 20 gallon glass tank with 92 on hot side with UTH and red bulb heat lamp. Temp on cool side is 80 and humidity is 50 to 60% with hides on both sides and a water dish in middle. Substrate is reptibark. Also put in tree and plastic plants for added security. Did not handle snake and waited 3 days before placing snake in shoe box with live fuzzy mouse for 45 minutes with no luck. Waited another week and tried same with no luck. Waited a couple more days and placed f/t fuzzy mouse inside enclosure outside snake's hide and left overnight-still no luck. I've read not to handle snake until he begins eating but it's difficult with a 10 year old so he has held the snake for a couple of minutes twice in the past 2 and 1/2 weeks. Snake appears healthy and often moves around the tank flicking his tongue. My questions are:

-How long should I wait before trying to feed again?
-Should I feed live or dead?
-Should I feed outside the enclosure or inside?
-If I feed inside, can (should I) I leave a live fuzzy mouse inside the enclosure overnight as I've read that a mouse that small can't harm the snake?

Sorry this post is so long but I wanted to provide as many details as possible. My son already loves his new pet-he saved for months to buy it with his own money so I've got to get this thing to eat. Everything I read says not to panic but since it is a young snake and it's my son's pet, I guess you could say that I'm beginning to panic. Thanks in advance for any help or suggestions you can provide.

[sarahlovesmiike]

Ok guys. I need some help feeding my 10 year old son's juvenile captive bred BP. Bought him at the local pet store 2 and 1/2 weeks ago. Pet store said he ate fuzzy mice twice when fed in a paper bag and they recommended I feed outside the enclosure in a bag or shoe box so the snake won't be prone to biting inside his enclosure.

This is a myth. Pet stores are notorious for giving out ridiculous information.

-How long should I wait before trying to feed again?
-Should I feed live or dead?
-Should I feed outside the enclosure or inside?
-If I feed inside, can (should I) I leave a live fuzzy mouse inside the enclosure overnight as I've read that a mouse that small can't harm the snake?

-Post a picture of your setup, so we can help correct any errors. If the snake is moving around and exploring a lot then there is something wrong. We can help to address that issue. You will want to correct any errors and then wait a week for the snake to settle before trying to feed it.
-Definitely feed inside the enclosure. The will not become cage aggressive, unless the only reason you open the enclosure is to feed. And even then it's highly unlikely.
-I, personally, would feed live until the snake is eating regularly and gaining weight. After you are sure he isn't a picky eater, trying switching him to F/T. Its a personal choice, but feeding live is safe as long as you go about it the right way. Always supervise and never leave a rodent in the enclosure over night or for any length of time unsupervised. A small mouse, can and will chew on the snake.

[Stewart_Reptiles]

Depending on the size of the animal set him up in a 6 quarts or 15 quarts tub

with

1 or 2 hides depends on the tub size (must be tight with all sides touching your BP's body), Aspen bedding

80-84 on the cool side - 88-92 on the warm side

NO handling until the animals eat on it's own (3 to 5 meals)

Let the animal settle for a week

Offer live hopper mouse if it is an hatchling or prey equal to the girth size of your snake (fuzzy are way too small for any snake)

Offer food in the enclosure, remove after 20 minutes if not eaten.

[Farnsworth]

-Post a picture of your setup, so we can help correct any errors. If the snake is moving around and exploring a lot then there is something wrong. We can help to address that issue. You will want to correct any errors and then wait a week for the snake to settle before trying to feed it.
-Definitely feed inside the enclosure. The will not become cage aggressive, unless the only reason you open the enclosure is to feed. And even then it's highly unlikely.

I tried unsuccessfully to upload a picture of the set-up.

I was under the impression that him moving around alot was a good thing but it sounds like that may not be the case. The hide on the hot side is a full log laying on its' end so the only opening is at the top. From what I read here, I believe that is the best. The hide on the cool side is a half log. Maybe I should replace the half log with a full log so the hides are identical on both sides?

[Farnsworth]

Depending on the size of the animal set him up in a 6 quarts or 15 quarts tub

with

1 or 2 hides depends on the tub size (must be tight with all sides touching your BP's body), Aspen bedding

80-84 on the cool side - 88-92 on the warm side

NO handling until the animals eat on it's own (3 to 5 meals)

Let the animal settle for a week

Offer live hopper mouse if it is an hatchling or prey equal to the girth size of your snake (fuzzy are way too small for any snake)

Offer food in the enclosure, remove after 20 minutes if not eaten.

Deborah-thanks for the response. My temps are within range and consistent. I am reluctant to take down the current set-up in favor of the tub you mentioned as my son purchased and picked out the glass enclosure, hides, etc. If absolutely necessary to induce feeding, I definitely will, but I'm wondering if you think there is something else I can try first. He knows he will not be able to handle the snake for the next several weeks but at least with the current set-up he will be able to look at the snake and enjoy the habitat that he purchased. I'm unsure of the mouse terminology but what I have been offering is equal to the girth of the snake-probably the hopper you mentioned. What is the advantage of the aspen bedding over the reptibark?

[Stewart_Reptiles]

My guess is that you an CH hatchling on your hand that may or may not have been started on food, at this time of the year they are commonly found in pet store and because of their very young age they need very specific setup and condition to get started and help the feed with consistency before moving to something bigger.

Even when eating with consistency a 10 gallons tank will likely be better suited at this stage.

For now the priority is to get this animal to eat and what I recommended will in the majority of cases help start most hatchling / picky feeder. (Every part counts from the size of the enclosure to the specific bedding)

Aspen is usually used with young hatchlings that will not take their first meal and makes wonder (My theory is the ability to bury in it and feel more secure)

Good luck

[AkHerps]

If you don't want to switch to another set up you need to make some changes. Those logs don't sound very secure for the snake, they like to be smashed up inside something, they don't like extra room in their hides.

These are all good hides or you can make your own:
http://www.thehognosesnake.co.uk/ima...ke_to_hide.jpg

Clutter up the tank, make it so he doesn't have a lot of floor space. You can add more hides, or crumpled newspaper.

OR Add a divider for the tank to make it smaller. I did this in my 20 long tank.

Leave it alone for a little while, about a week, then either put an adult hopper mouse, or a live adult very small mouse in it's enclosure and always supervise. You can sit there for a couple hours if you have too, sometimes it takes them a little while to get the idea then they will start taking it faster and faster.

[corgigirl9]

I would go with a 6 or 15 qt tub also at least until the snake is eating regularly. A 6 qt steralite tub averages a dollar and there clear so you can still look at the snake. Heat pad on the bottom with a thermostat and the thermometer and humidity readings correct. Paper towel as bedding and For a hide, put a small cardboard box (with a hole) and a water dish in. Drill holes in the plastic lid. Worked miracles for me when my newest addition wasn't eating in her ten gallon tank.
Good luck

[Farnsworth]

If you don't want to switch to another set up you need to make some changes. Those logs don't sound very secure for the snake, they like to be smashed up inside something, they don't like extra room in their hides.

Clutter up the tank, make it so he doesn't have a lot of floor space. You can add more hides, or crumpled newspaper.

Leave it alone for a little while, about a week, then either put an adult hopper mouse, or a live adult very small mouse in it's enclosure and always supervise. You can sit there for a couple hours if you have too, sometimes it takes them a little while to get the idea then they will start taking it faster and faster.

UPDATE

I put in a couple more tight hides (cluttered up the enclosure) and blacked out the back and sides. Left the snake alone and waited for a few days. Fed a live pinky/fuzzy rat inside the enclosure at night. Took him a good 30 minutes but he made his way over to the prey and curled up beside it for a few minutes before devouring it. Super stoked!

I have found this forum to be very informative. Thanks for the advice and quick responses.

Assuming that we continue to not handle the snake and use the same technique and prey at next feeding, should I expect him to start eating regularly?

[DemmBalls]

UPDATE

I put in a couple more tight hides (cluttered up the enclosure) and blacked out the back and sides. Left the snake alone and waited for a few days. Fed a live pinky/fuzzy rat inside the enclosure at night. Took him a good 30 minutes but he made his way over to the prey and curled up beside it for a few minutes before devouring it. Super stoked!

I have found this forum to be very informative. Thanks for the advice and quick responses.

Assuming that we continue to not handle the snake and use the same technique and prey at next feeding, should I expect him to start eating regularly?

Glad to hear! This forum is incredibly helpful!

You will find that the words "eating" and "regular" are two words that normally don't work in the same sentence when keeping Ball Pythons. They tend to be finicky eaters in general and will randomly go off feed for weeks or months at a time. I do have some that will feed every week as soon as the prey is presented, then others are very hit and miss.

To answer your question the best I can...your snake will likely become a more consistent feeder, but don't be surprised if he starts refusing in the future. They are normally stronger/more regular feeders as babies though.