took this female out of the group and put her in a smaller breeding cage when i noticed she was getting a bit porky
i do this because i've had problems with new-borns being eaten

she dropped about 7-9 days later (if i remember correctly), and had 11 in the 1st litter
as said in my original post - she then dropped this second litter of 8 (of which only 6 have made it), after the first lot had 'as near as' weaned

no other males or females can/could get to her - she's on a different shelf...