Wild Caught Ball Pythons

[SpiderBP]

Hey if some1 made a order of wild caught pythons can u raise ur hand, shame on u

Huh? I'm afraid I don't undertand your statement...?

I will be happy to read it again if you could explain it to me?

-SpiderBP

[Oxylepy]

They were calling out people who have purchased/ordered wild caught animals and then scolding them for disagreeing with it.

Also I didn't say we would do it "some day" I said if there is an issue with their numbers in the wild then we should help. Believe me there is no shortage of normal BPs being produced, and even single trait codoms being made, we could easily send out hundreds to be released in the wild with no negative effect on the industry and (provided we know its necessary beforehand) it would help bolster any dwindling population in the wild. There are plenty of people producing hundreds of snakes a year, all it would take is a return shipment to Africa of some of these snakes.

Add in that many people around here actually care about these snakes in general, not just the ones in our collections, I'm quite sure that if were published that the wild population is dwindling, then hundreds, if not thousands, of people would end up donating to help, money that could be used to either set up breeding programs in Africa or to send hundreds of snakes back to be released in the wild.

[Tikall]

They were calling out people who have purchased/ordered wild caught animals and then scolding them for disagreeing with it.

Also I didn't say we would do it "some day" I said if there is an issue with their numbers in the wild then we should help. Believe me there is no shortage of normal BPs being produced, and even single trait codoms being made, we could easily send out hundreds to be released in the wild with no negative effect on the industry and (provided we know its necessary beforehand) it would help bolster any dwindling population in the wild. There are plenty of people producing hundreds of snakes a year, all it would take is a return shipment to Africa of some of these snakes.

Add in that many people around here actually care about these snakes in general, not just the ones in our collections, I'm quite sure that if were published that the wild population is dwindling, then hundreds, if not thousands, of people would end up donating to help, money that could be used to either set up breeding programs in Africa or to send hundreds of snakes back to be released in the wild.

You can't send captive reptiles back into the wild. Who knows what sorts of immunities our snakes have picked up from other herps in our collections, or if we might accidentally introduce a nonnative parasite? Sending "contaminated" captive animals back into the wild is not a real option, as it could end up doing more harm than good.

[Oxylepy]

Then you could always fund breeding programs in Africa with already established snakes that exist there, helping the snakes there repopulate by reducing the likelihood of them dying from predation.

[SpiderBP]

Then you could always fund breeding programs in Africa with already established snakes that exist there, helping the snakes there repopulate by reducing the likelihood of them dying from predation.

I understand what you are trying to say. The thing is...other than the pet-trade, and skin-trade...the only other major factor that is impeding on the continued survival of ball pythons in the wild is the fact that they are eaten as food in many places in Africa.

You can cut out the skin-trade.
You can stop importing WC Ball Pythons.
But how are you going to tell an already starving people, who have been there almost as long as these snakes, that they are no longer allowed to eat them, but we are going to keep importing them because they are *pretty*...?

[Oxylepy]

Who said I was telling them to stop from eating available resources? I'm not saying they should stop eating them at all. I'm just saying that we shouldn't abandon all importation of WC animals. What if we find a reduced pattern red and white snake out there? That could be worth a hundred thousand dollars, money that could go to helping the local population.

And a breeding program doesn't mean you stop people from eating the wild animals, it just means you set up an area for the balls to breed in and remove predation from those balls to help to boost the wild population.

Addition:

My whole argument is for pulling out potentially valuable animals that can help to earn the people in Africa money, not to stop them from eating the animals they can get, not to continue bringing thousands of animals into this country, not to interfere with the local population in a huge way. In fact I'm saying that if the local population dwindles we should definitely fund breeding of animals in Africa to help boost that so they don't become endangered in the wild but remain, hopefully, locally common.

And if it came down to needing a breeding program I'm pretty sure that the same people who sent 50,000 letters to the government about HR 669 would be willing to part with 25 to a thousand dollars a year (depending on personal income) to help fund it. If we really care about the snakes then we would all be willing to part with a small fraction of our income to help out the wild population of the species.

[SpiderBP]

My point about bringing up them eating them was that they aren't going to spend money (that they don't have) to save a food source such as a ball python. They will just find another food source.
Assuming (and I could be wrong) that the African Nations that have wild populations of BP's don't fund a breeding program...who will?
Yes we have a big community of herpers willing to donate money if it came down to it...but will it be enough?

BILLIONS are donated to countries in Africa and there are still children starving, dying...
Kids don't have food, medicine, shelter? Young women don't have access to feminine products. Rape, starvation, everything horrible you can think of. And still it's not enough.

You mean to tell me you think people will donate money to save a species of snake, when they won't even save fellow human beings? I mean, I love snakes...but if it came down to saving the ENTIRE population of BP's...or saving 100 children, I'm gonna have to go with the children. And I would think that any other decent human being would be the same....

[SpiderBP]

My whole argument is for pulling out potentially valuable animals that can help to earn the people in Africa money....

Let me leave you with this...because I'm about to pass out....

Of the millions (dare I say billions) of dollars made in the wide-world of Ball Python breeding....how much do you think has gone back to the land that the original morphs were discovered in? (I bet it's not as much as one would hope)


Thanks for "arguing" with me man. It's been great, and it's been an even better discussion...hopefully some more people join in....

I'll be on later today to see what else has went down....


Later,
SpiderBP

[captin_crash]

I live in Africa (South Africa) I might not be in the countries where they are catching ball pythons but I do know about the people of Africa and let me say that if these guys are catching ball pythons to put food on the table I don’t see a problem.

On a regular basis I have people from across the border asking me if they can work in my garden, some of these people have degrees but the situation in their own countries is so bad they risk their lives (most illegal immigrants come to South Africa through the Kruger national park where they encounter lions, leopards and Nile crocodiles) to come here to do meaningless jobs.
This is the length that people will go through just to live and support their families.

Some families live of a dollars worth of food a week so that WC ball python you see at petco is someone’s lively hood.

I love all animals and ball pythons are one of my favourites but I love people more.

This just my opinion and is not an attack on anyone.

[Danounet]

Poverty, corruption and crime are no joke. These are the 3 main reason why immigrants leave their home contries. The last 2 is mostly why my parents decided to leave ours. Corruption and crime is eating our home contry appart. When you include extreme poverty to the mix, it is just brutal to the body, mind and soul. When these people realise this, that is when they will risk anything to flee somewhere else. Look at the cubans that flee in poorly kept together rafts for example. There are countless stories of cubans perishing to shark attacks....

Giving money to an already corrupt goverment wont fix anything, it will make it worse if anything.