Finally introducing Snickets!

[tbowman]

I... don't even know where to start. I wasn't trying to argue with you either, just replying to you criticizing my video on youtube. How am I not supposed to reply to that? I'm not one to lie down and take a beating.

I'm not feeding her live because it's my preference. Sure, if she has a problem with live I will try other things, among them being F/T. Like I said in my previous post, she won't pay attention to F/T. Being that she has no problem eating live (I would know cuz I watch when I feed her) I'm not going to change it up. I had a hard time getting her to feed, and now that she's comfortable, I'm not going to mess with it.

So now you're saying that I'm putting my snake in harms way? Wow... I didn't know sitting beside her while she feeds and making sure the mouse doesn't bite or scratch her is putting her in harms way. Maybe I should just walk away?

Things can happen quicker than you think and by time you intervene, it may be too late.

If you watch someone get shot, can you do anything about it? No, because it's too late.

There are hundreds of videos on youtube that have snakes feeding on live prey. If you're going to give me a guilt trip for putting ONE up, I expect that you have left a comment on every single other video on youtube doing the same.

Most people who feed live on youtube have no clue what they're doing. Have you ever read the comments on some of those videos? 99% of cases on youtube the owner is a complete idiot and shouldn't even own a snake.

You say that putting this video on youtube gives snakes a bad reputation. But then you say it makes people think all snake owners like to torture little mice and watch them die. So really you're worried about the reputation of snake owners. That's a solid worry. But think about this, people have owned snakes for 30+ years, one less video on youtube of a snake feeding on a live prey item (That was bred specifically for that use) is not going to change our reputation. If you went up to one person who had a problem with this, and explained to them that young snakes, especially Ball Pythons, are picky eaters and won't take an already dead mouse. Therefore, we have to feed live. Some people continue to feed live, some don't. It really depends on the snake. I'm sure they would understand.

At this rate, how long do you honestly see us being ABLE to have reptiles? Look at the bills hr2811, S373 and hr669. All of which were put into motion one way or another by irresponsible owners. The media and the government will try to find any reason they can for us not to be able to keep the animals we love.

Explain to me how was I not responsible. I'd love to know.

Already did.

Once again I'm looking out for the best interest of you, your snake, and the herp community.

[americangypsy]

I understand nature completely . I also understand that by having collections sometimes well into the hundreds and having to feed them living food has nothing to do with nature and everything to do with our own personal desire to watch what we think is nature . In nature snakes are not hand fed in a small area a guaranteed meal .We forget that nature happens outside our window not in a tub set up for only one winner it is fixed no need to place bets . I have some baby snakes and have had no problem feeding them F/T . Some snakes may be picky but from what I have seen it is usually people not willing to put in the extra time or they think that their snake is missing out on something . Well it is , it's freedom . We have bred them to be pets why must we act like they are Tiger's who I am pretty sure also do not get live food if in captivity . I don't mean to sound rude this is just the way I see it . If other compassionate people think it goes down like this for every pet snake and rodent I believe it would stir them to action on fighting this just as people fight against animal testing . What makes human kind stronger then other living things is the HUMANity our ability to choose compassion over aggression . I don't think a snake will need counseling for not being given live food , but what does it say about us if we choose to not allow the mouse a peaceful death of sleep over suffocation .Witch would you prefer ?

P.s . I am not attacking you This is more just for the general topic of this discussion . and only my personal opinion

[Elise.m]

Things can happen quicker than you think and by time you intervene, it may be too late.

If you watch someone get shot, can you do anything about it? No, because it's too late.

You can't see it in the video. My BF was also watching, alot closer than I was. A bullet is alot quick than a devastating mouse bite.

Most people who feed live on youtube have no clue what they're doing. Have you ever read the comments on some of those videos? 99% of cases on youtube the owner is a complete idiot and shouldn't even own a snake.

Yes, I've read the comments. Alot of people who watch the videos are other snake owners, or future snake owners. There is the occasional "Omg you're so horrible you're going to ___"

At this rate, how long do you honestly see us being ABLE to have reptiles? Look at the bills hr2811, S373 and hr669. All of which were put into motion one way or another by irresponsible owners. The media and the government will try to find any reason they can for us not to be able to keep the animals we love.

So far, I think we're doing a pretty darn good job at fighting those bills. I forsee we'll be able to own reptiles for a very long time.

Once again I'm looking out for the best interest of you, your snake, and the herp community.

I'd prefer you not look out for me and my snake. I'm doing just fine. Thanks though.

[Elise.m]

I understand nature completely . I also understand that by having collections sometimes well into the hundreds and having to feed them living food has nothing to do with nature and everything to do with our own personal desire to watch what we think is nature . In nature snakes are not hand fed in a small area a guaranteed meal .We forget that nature happens outside our window not in a tub set up for only one winner it is fixed no need to place bets . I have some baby snakes and have had no problem feeding them F/T . Some snakes may be picky but from what I have seen it is usually people not willing to put in the extra time or they think that their snake is missing out on something . Well it is , it's freedom . We have bred them to be pets why must we act like they are Tiger's who I am pretty sure also do not get live food if in captivity . I don't mean to sound rude this is just the way I see it . If other compassionate people think it goes down like this for every pet snake and rodent I believe it would stir them to action on fighting this just as people fight against animal testing . What makes human kind stronger then other living things is the HUMANity our ability to choose compassion over aggression . I don't think a snake will need counseling for not being given live food , but what does it say about us if we choose to not allow the mouse a peaceful death of sleep over suffocation .Witch would you prefer ?

P.s . I am not attacking you This is more just for the general topic of this discussion . and only my personal opinion

Although I do not share the same opinion as you, I want to thank you for not coming off so strong and making it clear you are not attacking me.

Edit: Although I started this thread, I will not be replying to it anymore. So people who have problems with live feedings and what not flame away. I won't reply, even though I'll sit in my chair boiling to reply. I'll take the higher road

[tbowman]

You can't see it in the video. My BF was also watching, alot closer than I was. A bullet is alot quick than a devastating mouse bite.



Yes, I've read the comments. Alot of people who watch the videos are other snake owners, or future snake owners. There is the occasional "Omg you're so horrible you're going to ___"



So far, I think we're doing a pretty darn good job at fighting those bills. I forsee we'll be able to own reptiles for a very long time.



I'd prefer you not look out for me and my snake. I'm doing just fine. Thanks though.

Mouse and Rat bites can be lethal. What about parasites? Sticking something in the mouses mouth isn't going to stop them.

There are more negative comments than positives.

Those bills didn't exist until recently. We shouldn't have to be fighting them.

You may be just fine... For now.

And for the record, I've stated that I wasn't attacking you in any way. I simply said I don't see the point in live videos on youtube.

[jglass38]

Are you guys kidding with this? Give it a break. People should feed whatever is right for their snakes and themselves. I have fed more live prey than I can remember and I have never had an incident. Live feeding, when done responsibly and with the right sized prey for the animal is perfectly safe. I watched the video and I don't see anything wrong with what Elise did. The prey item was a safe size and the snake was never in danger. If she had thrown a medium rat in there I could see you being up in arms over it. She isn't taking joy in the death of the animal, but rather joy in how proud she is of her snake eating. Should you feed F/T? If you want to. Should you try to shame people for not feeding F/T? No way. Have all the opinions you want, but don't try to pass off incorrect information as fact or make someone feel bad about their feeder choices.

[jglass38]

Mouse and Rat bites can be lethal. What about parasites? Sticking something in the mouses mouth isn't going to stop them.

There are more negative comments than positives.

Those bills didn't exist until recently. We shouldn't have to be fighting them.

You may be just fine... For now.

And for the record, I've stated that I wasn't attacking you in any way. I simply said I don't see the point in live videos on youtube.

Your arguments are ridiculous. And after seeing your signature and what site you came from, it's no surprise. Did the zombie frozen thawed zealots of that other forum send you over to spread the gospel? Get your facts straight and for god sake, stop reading that ridiculous forum.

EDIT : Wow. I recognize both tbowman and americangypsy from THAT site. Shocking. If I'm wrong about that, please let me know.

[tbowman]

Ridiculous? no.

I'm not even going to try, there is no getting through with you people.

[jglass38]

Ridiculous? no.

That is your argument? Back up your propaganda with some hard facts. And please don't show me the picture of the snake that has been bitten up by a rat. That has been going around since 1990.

[Samuel]

This entire thread is getting a little redic.

Elise, you did nothing wrong. Like was said before that was a perfect sized meal, and I can tell you care a lot about the well being of your animal. Keep doing what is working for you because no one knows that animal better. The video was awesome, and I thank you for sharing it.

I am leaving the thread now. Nothing like taking a personal video thread and cramming your agenda down it's throat trying to kill it.