Already breeding, but not enough...

[chromeitout]

I have breeding rats for about a year now, but now that my bp collection has grown in size and numbers I am going to have to expand. I produce WAY more mice than I can use so that project is good, but I need some opinions on what and how many racks/breeders you guys think I should build to give me what I need (I plan to build something tomorrow).

Right now I have 14 bp's. 3 are taking large rats, 3 are taking smalls, and 8 are taking mediums. More production than I need is better than less.

I only have one rack for rats so far. It is a 7 high concrete tub rack. It has 1.2 or 1.3 in 4 tubs, 1 weaner tub, 1 holdback tub and 1 empty.

I have watched all of the RDR youtube vids., and love the way he is set up. My thinking is bringing me to believe that I should use my current rack for weans and rest for moms, and I should build a 12 tub jumbo litter pan breeder rack w/ 1.5 each. Does this sound right? Also, how many birthing tubs would you recommend for this number if you agree? would a 24 tubber like my mice racks be enough or not? Any help woud be appreciated as I would like to build at least 1 rack tomorrow.

[TankMasterOG]

sounds like you got the right idea....love the racks is ther a DIY some where or did you just watch Rdr vids till you got it right?

[suzuki4life]

I have breeding rats for about a year now, but now that my bp collection has grown in size and numbers I am going to have to expand. I produce WAY more mice than I can use so that project is good, but I need some opinions on what and how many racks/breeders you guys think I should build to give me what I need (I plan to build something tomorrow).

Right now I have 14 bp's. 3 are taking large rats, 3 are taking smalls, and 8 are taking mediums. More production than I need is better than less.

I only have one rack for rats so far. It is a 7 high concrete tub rack. It has 1.2 or 1.3 in 4 tubs, 1 weaner tub, 1 holdback tub and 1 empty.

I have watched all of the RDR youtube vids., and love the way he is set up. My thinking is bringing me to believe that I should use my current rack for weans and rest for moms, and I should build a 12 tub jumbo litter pan breeder rack w/ 1.5 each. Does this sound right? Also, how many birthing tubs would you recommend for this number if you agree? would a 24 tubber like my mice racks be enough or not? Any help woud be appreciated as I would like to build at least 1 rack tomorrow.

to increase would require more info

but with the info provided, I would suggest switching as many of your mice eating snakes over to rat pups if you can...

down sizing your mouse breeding and increasing your rat breeding.

I would increase the colony sizes in the concrete mixing tubs and personally...in any situation where large rats are needed...I would do away with the birthing rack...
Turn your birthing rack into a grow out rack...

purpose of a birthing rack is to allow mothers time to rest...in a production set up resting is bad. The more they produce continuosly, the quicker they will grow and the fatter they will get at a younger age...(these are your larges you will eventually be feeding)


Does each snake only eat one rat at the given size? How often do you feed them? how many mice do you have in a colony?

[chromeitout]

There is not a DIY for these mouse racks specifically, I just looked at a bunch of them and built what I thought was best for me. Although, I did use a DIY (can't find link right now) to build the rat rack a couple years back (was used for a mouse rack then).

Does each snake only eat one rat at the given size? How often do you feed them? how many mice do you have in a colony?

Yes, they only eat 1 rat each per week. It is possible that I could feed more to them, but I haven't fully got the hang of how much and how often is too much and too often for bp's yet. Most of my collection are corn snakes, thus the need to produce alot of mouse pinks-hoppers. I guess I could try changing all of my adults over to rats, but I have to get them going first. As far as the mice, I have between 1.3 and 1.8 per tub in one whole rack (1.8's are for freezing pinks for the hatchlings). The other rack is nothing but weaners and grow outs (+/- 25 per tub). Also, I'm the sole supplier of a local pet store for their mice (and will be rats as well when I get them going), so I can't really drop any production on the mice. I just need to build whatever I need to expand the rats.

Also, a little more info (in case it matters)... All of the bps eat live or pk (not f/t), so I need to have enough of the "right size" live each week to feed them.

[m00kfu]

wrong name...

[littleindiangirl]

RDR has his set up with the breeders in the litter pans, and the mothers raising in small pans. The only thing I have against his set up, is he is using mouse breeding tubs as female nursing racks, and these are incredibly short and cramped.

I would use the concrete as breeding, and the litter pans as nursing. It's how we do it and it works out well, without leaving the female and her young hardly able to turn around.

RDR has a lot of videos on how he does it. He puts girls in to breed, then he pulls them into the nursing tubs, and when they wean he puts them back in to breed.

I must point out, there is no evidence to support that a female bred back to back (i.e., not removed from males, litter every 3-4 weeks) will grow larger on a linear scale with the increase in her litters. Female rats will grow based on genetics, I can't say in all of my readings that I have ever come across his idea or anything to support it.

I like the RDR method far better than allowing females to have a litter every 3-4 weeks. Some people do it this way though, which I believe is what Suzuki is referring to. (I think, I'm unsure of what he does). I personally disagree with that method,... call it the animal lover in me.

[chromeitout]

I agree that the mice trays are a bit narrow for nursing (9 1/2 x 21 1/2 x 3 1/2). The tubs that I use in my mice racks are 15 1/2 x 18 1/2 x 4. Do you think this will be appropriate? They are the same footprint as the Van Ness tubs, (and both will fit my current racks) but not as deep. I can get these locally for $3 each and have no idea where to get the van ness ones without paying shipping.

I guess you're right about the concrete tubs being the way to go. I only have 1.3 in my concrete tubs, but I feel 1.5 would still be fine, however 1.5 in a jumbo litter pan would be a little cramped.

Ok, so lets assume the litter pans I'm currently using are sufficient for birthing/nursing single moms, and the concrete ones are what I will use for breeding, weaning and holding extra moms. It works out well to have the litter pan racks 8 high x 3 wide (24 tubs), which will be room for 24 moms to give birth and nurse up to weaning. The concrete tubs 1 wide x 7 tall (7 tubs) will give me 7 male and 35 female breeders. Then 1 more concrete rack would give me 7 tubs to use for weaners, hold backs, and extra moms. Does this seem like it will produce over enough to fill my needs? Is this what you would do or should I have more or less of something?