The effects of ball pythons on the reptile community

[b8g8]

An ecological risk assessment of nonnative boas and pythons as potentially invasive species in the United States.
Risk Anal. 2005 Jun;25(3):753-66.

I have this paper.....but have yet to read it seriously.

I'm going to acquire it and see what I can learn. Thanks for the link.

[MarkS]

Any thoughts now, two years later?

I think an awful lot of the people who were in it JUST for the money are now gone, and good riddance. You can still make money at breeding morphs, you just have to work harder for it now.

I'm glad I'm just a hobbyist and don't have to worry about any of that 'makin money' nonsense...

[aSnakeLovinBabe]

I think that ball pythons are really fun and interesting to have in their own way. I have 8 and I love them to death. There is not a snake in my collection that is easier to maintain. I have a huge appreciation for good looking normals and that's mostly what I own aside from my spider and pastel. I think that anyone who is in this hobby for money needs to go elsewhere, where living creatures are not involved.

I will admit, I get really tired of looking at just ball pythons (and at times, blood pythons and red tailed boas) at reptile shows, and having to wade through them to find other snakes at shows. It's a little ridiculous at just how many people want to talk ball pythons, and if it's not a BP they are not interested. Having said that, being largely a keeper of semi aquatic species (garter and water snakes) which are MUCH more work and maintenance than ball pythons due to the amounts of food they eat, how often they eat, and the ridiculous amount of POOP and the SPACE that they use because they are so active, I tend to get bored easily with my ball pythons. I love keeping my active, zoom around the cage all day snakes, and I certainly wish more people would give them a try! but only if they are going to do it the right way!

[zackw419]

I think Ball Pythons are great. They are a gateway snake. Alot of times they are the first snake people have, and do to their docile nature they make people want to own more snakes.

I just don't like it when people get so into the morphs that they treat BP's like merchandise. (Not directed towards anyone in particular, I'm well aware that many breeders are not this way.)


Over-all I think ball pythons are great snakes but I don't think they are among the most fun to own.

[anatess]

I love the ball pythons. And I can tell you that this time last year, if I saw a snake, I'm going for the shovel to chop its head off! Ever since my husband came home with our first ball python, I have turned 180 degrees and would go psycho if I see a neighbor trying to chop off a wild racer snake running in the backyard. So, yeah, the popularity of the ball python is definitely a big plus to the reptile community.

Also, we got a spider. And like all spiders, he had a head wobble - a slight one. His head would bob up and down when he lifts his head and holds it up (like when staking out his rat). We got him when he was only 100g or so. He is now about 800 grams and I don't see the head bobbing anymore. So, he grew out of it! So, yeah, I don't know if you could call that a defect or just a distinctive trait. You know, like my bichon frise dog who runs in wide circles like a busy bee - a distinctive trait of bichon frises.

[wolfy-hound]

Having just read this thread, I want to comment.
Many of the objections given by people against ball python keeping are things that are opinions.
Some hate anyone that might dare to attempt to make money off any animal. They don't care if it's profit, or if the animals are well taken care of, and loved. It's simply evil to them to try to make money off the animal. I'm not sure what they think would happen if selling was outlawed, since many breeders couldn't afford to breed if they had to give away the babies. I guess they believe it would be good, since there would be fewer pets. Or they simply do not think that far.

Other people hate morphs. They believe any morph is a genetic mutt and a defect, and should be culled. These people will be especially against the ball python boom, since it's so focused on the variety of morphs. I've seen people claim that all albinos are inbred, and go blind, etc. All morphs are inbred, despite proof to the contrary. All morphs are defective, despite proof to the contrary. Etc. You can't really argue with people who refuse to be distracted in their opinions with the facts. I don't mind if someone prefers normals, but don't make up facts, just becuase you dislike morphs. These love the spider wobble, pointing at that as the absolute proof that all morphs are defective culls.

Many people hate anything that becomes extremely popular. They feel ball python owners are touting THEIR species over any other species, and calling all the rest worthless, becuase they say ball pythons are the best. These are the ones that get angry if a singer gets popular, and call people who like that singer fakes, just because they were not exposed to the singer before he "made it big". So everyone who comes to ball pythons NOW, are just "jumping on the bandwagon" instead of only being exposed to an animal they truely like, and didn't think about owning prior to having them everywhere at shows, etc.

Then there's who are convinced that if there are that many ball pythons being sold, that they must be going extinct in the wild. Ball python habitat is actually expanding, as the clearing for farms creates the perfect place for rodents and thus ball pythons. Their natural predetors are fewer(not that this is a good thing) but again, don't confuse them with facts. Especially don't try to mention that most of the snakes sold at shows seem to CBB now. Yes, we still import a high number, but they don't overwhelm the show numbers. I have to shake my head when I overhear someone pointing at a group of albinos and pastels on a table of a big breeder and declaring that "See, they're becoming extinct in africa, because people keep importing them". Hmm.. yes...

Now you have those that are merely angry that ball pythons are a fairly easy to keep species, and thus worthless to any "serious keeper". As if the animal being kept HAS to be extremely difficult or it's just not worth doing. These are people who look down their nose at people who ride their bike around the park on a weekend, instead of competeing in the mountain biking races held overseas with the latest and greatest equipment. It doesn't have to be hard to be fun and fullfilling to do.

Maybe they dislike that ball pythons are 'lazy boring' snakes? They don't move fast, and don't do a lot. This is what attracts a lot of first time keepers TO balls. Fast moving active snakes can overwhelm a new keeper, when they can't contain the animal, and it is not content to be handled or just hang out. I LIKE that they just sit around, honestly. They seem placid and calm, as opposed to my cornsnake who leaps to escape any time there's a crack available.

All these are not aimed at any particular person, especially not anyone on this board. But it's various arguments I've heard, discussed or overheard, mainly at shows dominated by ball pythons and their morphs. I'll hazard a guess that leopard gecko fans were treated somewhat the same, to a lesser degree, when they first started really breeding all the various morphs there.

All in all, just opinions, and yes, the ones that are in it Just For the Profit, will move on when the craze dies down. Yes, some of those will flood the market with cheapo versions, and scam folks with false hets and morphs. Just like people selling fake Prada bags, people sell fake hets. Something else will grow popular, and ball pythons will not be on top anymore. Those of us that appreciate the species for it's good points will still be around, and still discussing why others don't prefer them.

All of the above is just my own rambling and should be taken as such, not as scientific study, nor as proven facts. Any attempt to use such ramblings as such will be laughed at tremendously.

[TheOtherLeadingBrand]

Great points! I totally agree. I had balls before I even knew morphs existed, because I LIKE them.

[daniel1983]

Interesting to see this thread brought back up. A few points in reflection....

1. I have tried to find several species of reptiles once commonly kept in this hobby.....only to find that they are now 'rare'. Professional breeders have moved on to what makes money...ball python morphs. Hobby keepers are the only thing keeping some once popular species going in captivity. There are morphs (and even species) of some reptiles that have 'gone extinct in captivity' because keepers simply stopped breeding them to move on to more profitable reptiles. .....it really shows who cares about the animals and who cares about the money.

2. Legislation Without the popularity and monetary aspect of ball python morphs, I honestly believe that the recent legislation would have passed with ease. I am thankful that ball pythons have pulled more people into the hobby of keeping snakes....the more people we have the better chances we have of preserving this hobby.

3. I think some people have finally started to 'get over the craze'...but the 'craze' has drawn in many people that will never leave this hobby. Like it was said.....ball pythons can be a 'gateway' reptile.....I know they were for me

[wolfy-hound]

Just curious, which species are now nearly unfindable that were common in the pet trade? I only remember vaguely burmese, retics, balls, corns and redtails? boas.

[daniel1983]

Just curious, which species are now nearly unfindable that were common in the pet trade? I only remember vaguely burmese, retics, balls, corns and redtails? boas.

Most small monitor species are extreamly hard to find in the US. I know of one keeper that sold his entire collection (including a breeding group of Storr's monitors) to focus on ball python and boa morphs. While it is 100% a keepers right to choose what to keep, I can see how it can hurt the community when someone gives up breeding an animal that is only bred by 2 or 3 people in North America. Some species such as King's monitors 'went extinct' in the US. I know of one keeper that managed to import a group from Canada, but he has not had success breeding them yet. These monitors were once produced in quantity by commercial breeders....what happened?

From my observations, the 'rarity' of species seems to increase when that animal is not able to be imported into this country and/or when that animal is not as easy to keep. Look at children's pythons for example. How many children's pythons breeders can you list?

I do not think that the lack of focus on other species is caused by ONLY ball pythons though. More like reptile 'morphs' in general. People seem to avoid 'normal' reptiles these days...

IF someone hatched albino children's pythons, how do you think people would react? I would bet that there be more people breeding them within the next year.

But like I said. I don't really think it is the doing of ball pythons alone.....more like people being lured to the possiblity of making large sums of money off of easily breedable reptiles