Male Blackbee

[TheReptileEnthusiast]

I'd be having a word with Mr Colin Weaver If I was you.

Het hypo it may be, but I can't see anyhting other than spider in that.

Not a very well thought out post for your 3rd post on this forum. You probably should have run a search and realized Colin is one of most knoledgable and well respected keepers/breeders on this site.

[Wh00h0069]

This is happening more and more.....

People try to "SAVE THE DAY" by busting a "scam" artist.

Get lives people. Not everyone is out to rip someone off.

I like how everyone that actually thought Colin would rip someone off have absolutely no idea of who or what they are talking about.

3rd post here, and calling a professional breeder (who has done business with tons of people) a scammer.
How ridiculous is that?

I and most of the other posters were not trying to bust a scammer. We were just stating that the animal just looked like a normal spider. As Colin said, “It is not an impressive morph to look at and I can see how a photo may not allow you to see the subtle indicators that make them recognizable.” We were just looking for clarification, which Colin was nice enough to give us.

[toddmbecker1234]

First off, thanks to Colin for coming back to "defend" his snake before I had a chance. When put side by side the black bee and the spider has quite difference appearances. I am no where near a good photographer but in general the black bees colors are darker and tend to have much more white showing then a typical spider. The head tends to have a slightly washed out look. I totally understand that the snake is not a "wow" snake and that is not why I posted it. For you all that can appreciate the genetic possibilities with this snake you know why I financially sacrificed a little to obtain one. Right now he has bred with two normal females, but next year he will be hooking up with a black pastel and a ghost. If everything goes as planned I will be picking up a black pewter to go with him. Think of the potential when bred to a black pewter. Its amazing what this snake can bring to the table. I will talk to Colin and see if I can bring it over to his place in the near future and get some good pics...maybe a pic with a normal spider so you all can see the differences. Anyway, thanks for all the responses...Todd

[SUPERBALLS]

ok so i dont know you colin, but from what i have heard is your a great guy and very knowledgeible breeder, but heres the deal i think people were stating that its not a black spider and not that they were slamming you, and to be honest it does look like a regular spider, if its so apperent that it is a black spider show more pics next to a spider, i really like black spiders and im not saying it isnt one, so before everyone starts getting on me, im not saying your lieing,
im starting to get a little worried about this forum, everyone thinks they know everything and people are just rude, lets just settle down

sorry i just relized some people did call you out, that is rediculous especilly from a couple people who dont know crap about this stuff anyways,

[ColinWeaver]

At this moment I'm trying to figure out why my website is down so I'm not super-focused on this thread but once I get it back up I will use it to better address this discussion. I'm glad to provide a thorough explanation and detailed pictures showing why a black pastel spider is what it is.

Before producing Black Pastel Spiders for myself I had only seen Cinnamon Spiders in John Berry's book and one that Brian Barczyk had on a table at a show. In photo and in person I though, "meh". I decided to cross the black pastel with a honey bee because I wanted to know if black pastel would look any different than cinnamon. In a way I was dinkering. I wondered if there was a big enough difference between the black pastel and cinnamon genes that it would make the black pastel spider do something weird. It didn't. In hindsight it did exactly what I could have guessed (but was hoping it wouldn't); it made the spider darker. The CinnaBee's I have seen seem to be lighter (which makes sense since cinnamon pastels are lighter than black pastels). When they were born there was no mistaking what they were but I was still going, "meh". I wasn't blown away by them. The albino spiders that hatched around the same time were much more captivating.

Spider pastels are BAM! Bumble Bee's are amazing. Everybody knows this. Compared to bumble bees, spider black pastels are a big visual disappointment. But that's not why they are so cool. In combination with the het ghost they are genetic powerhouses. I'm totally cool with a snake that doesn't wow people because I know it's an intermediate to something else wonderful. I'm a breeder. Projects take time and the black bee, wherever it is leading, is only a step along the way. To the best of my knowledge nobody has been producing black pastel spiders (probably because the cinnamon spider is so unimpressive looking compared to other spider morphs and because we're all such a secretive bunch). I think most people just chose to use their black pastel females for other stuff. I took a gamble with one of mine and I think it paid off. You could hide my black bees in a sea of normal spiders and I'd pick them out in a heartbeat. I don't think pictures on the Internet are reflecting that they have that kind of distinction.

As a final note: I can respect that the photo Todd took is not compelling so I find no fault with people wondering what's up. People can say whatever they want to say but Todd and I are cool because I know what I sold him and he knows what he got.

Now, I'm off to fix my web site....

Regards,

[Bill Buchman]

At this moment I'm trying to figure out why my website is down so I'm not super-focused on this thread but once I get it back up I will use it to better address this discussion. I'm glad to provide a thorough explanation and detailed pictures showing why a black pastel spider is what it is.

Before producing Black Pastel Spiders for myself I had only seen Cinnamon Spiders in John Berry's book and one that Brian Barczyk had on a table at a show. In photo and in person I though, "meh". I decided to cross the black pastel with a honey bee because I wanted to know if black pastel would look any different than cinnamon. In a way I was dinkering. I wondered if there was a big enough difference between the black pastel and cinnamon genes that it would make the black pastel spider do something weird. It didn't. In hindsight it did exactly what I could have guessed (but was hoping it wouldn't); it made the spider darker. The CinnaBee's I have seen seem to be lighter (which makes sense since cinnamon pastels are lighter than black pastels). When they were born there was no mistaking what they were but I was still going, "meh". I wasn't blown away by them. The albino spiders that hatched around the same time were much more captivating.

Spider pastels are BAM! Bumble Bee's are amazing. Everybody knows this. Compared to bumble bees, spider black pastels are a big visual disappointment. But that's not why they are so cool. In combination with the het ghost they are genetic powerhouses. I'm totally cool with a snake that doesn't wow people because I know it's an intermediate to something else wonderful. I'm a breeder. Projects take time and the black bee, wherever it is leading, is only a step along the way. To the best of my knowledge nobody has been producing black pastel spiders (probably because the cinnamon spider is so unimpressive looking compared to other spider morphs and because we're all such a secretive bunch). I think most people just chose to use their black pastel females for other stuff. I took a gamble with one of mine and I think it paid off. You could hide my black bees in a sea of normal spiders and I'd pick them out in a heartbeat. I don't think pictures on the Internet are reflecting that they have that kind of distinction.

As a final note: I can respect that the photo Todd took is not compelling so I find no fault with people wondering what's up. People can say whatever they want to say but Todd and I are cool because I know what I sold him and he knows what he got.

Now, I'm off to fix my web site....

Regards,

Well stated Colin!!! Some 2-gene animals need a third in the mix to make ALL the difference. Combine the Black Bee with Pastels, Butters, Fires etc. and your are cookin with gas.

[toddmbecker1234]

I totally agree that I think that this snake will be an amazing powerhouse when it comes to breeding. There are so many things I would like to do with this guy. Here is just a few lines I am thinking along: breeding it with a honey bee would create ghosts, spiders, black pastels, black bees, honeybees, and black pastel honey bees.
Breed it with a black pewter would create black pastels, pastels, spiders, black pewters, super black pastel, silver bullet, bumblebee, black bee, black pewter spider, super black pastel spider, and silver bullet spider. Plus all of the offspring would be 50% het ghost
I could go on and on about its potential but I think you all can understand where I am coming from. Thank you for everyone that has added constuctively to this thread. Todd

[SUPERBALLS]

well colin,
you didnt dissapoint, you are clearly a very intelitgent guy and very knowledged when it comes to breeding, and you seem like a great guy, i know i havent always got the best rap in this forum, but its because im so passionit about this hobby, but i would be glad to do buisness with you in the future colin, i have been doing this for a long time aswell, and i have always tried to do combos that others dont do, thats the funniest part, i hopefully will have some big suprises to show all you this season!!!!!!!

p.s. i know my grammer is god awful but hopefully you all can read it,
thanks

[ColinWeaver]

In hopes of helping everybody better understand the subtle differences some morphs have I have written a short article that explains (yes, with pictures) the black bee ball python (aka, black pastel spider).

You can read it here: http://ballpythonbreeder.com/2009/04...-black-pastel/


Regards,

[mason]

Not a very well thought out post for your 3rd post on this forum. You probably should have run a search and realized Colin is one of most knoledgable and well respected keepers/breeders on this site.

eh?

Admittedly I sometimes forget that I lurked for years before registering and posting but what exactly wasn't well thought out about my post? i'm supposed to accept that just because he's colin weaver he can't make a mistake?


I posted what I was thinking, it didn't look like anything but a spider to me, so thats what I said. I didn't make any accusations, shout or bash anyone.

I don't care how well respected someone is, they can all make mistakes. Bob clark once sent me (to the UK!) a cinnamon (crappy example of one) instead of a lemon pastel (top notch example of one). Should I have shut up because it was Bob clark?

I wasn't out to get at anybody, all I saw was spider, I commented accordingly. I didn't infer he was a scammer, if I thought as much i'd have said as much explicitly. Don't put words in my mouth.