just rescued this guy from one of those chain stores

[Eric Alan]

Thanks, Rob! I agree that some of the criticism is warranted. Much of the rest is because they are easy targets for bandwagon "down with the man" types.

I'm sure the higher-ups are, and have been, well aware of the stigma. How could they not be? As in any business, you are only as good as your employees. It's the education and buy-in of how many thousands of part-time types where the opportunity is - especially when it involves reptiles that they may or may not be thrilled to learn about. Let's face it - we aren't talking about cute and cuddly here. Not every employee can be expected to know the ins and outs of dog, cat, fish, small animal, bird, reptile, and amphibian care for every customer that comes in the door. Basics? Sure. Details? No. The flat out wrong information is most likely the employee going rogue because they are too embarrassed to ask or look for help. They feel like they are expected to know all of the answers because they are wearing the company shirt. When they don't, they refer back to what they think is tribal knowledge. Is that OK? No. Is it reality? Yes. If that kind of incorrect spew was coming from corporate, the companies would be in a lot worse off shape.

As far as pricing goes, the $25 vs $200 example is extreme, but I see what you're going for. Truth is, though, comparing retail vs hobbyist prices is like comparing apples and toasters. I would argue that it costs most hobbyists more to produce that lower priced animal than the price they get from selling it. Probably quite a bit more if they actually took the time to factor in all they have spent doing so. Unfortunately, most hobbyists have no clue what it costs them to make their animals. After all of that, whose pricing ends up sounding more crazy - hobbyist breeder or profitable retailer? We can't both complain about the state of the hobby and in the same breath complain about high retail prices.

Sorry, se7en, for hijacking your post. If you'd like, I can split this off and we can continue elsewhere.

[PitOnTheProwl]

I would argue that it costs most hobbyists more to produce that lower priced animal than the price they get from selling it. Probably quite a bit more if they actually took the time to factor in all they have spent doing so. Unfortunately, most hobbyists have no clue what it costs them to make their animals. After all of that, whose pricing ends up sounding more crazy - hobbyist breeder or profitable retailer? We can't both complain about the state of the hobby and in the same breath complain about high retail prices.

JUST my electric bill is about $100 to $150 higher per month for the rodents and reptiles. This doesn't include anything but heat and A/C.

[se7en]

Sorry, se7en, for hijacking your post. If you'd like, I can split this off and we can continue elsewhere.

no worries. at the end of the day, i care about the animals.

[Eric Alan]

no worries. at the end of the day, i care about the animals.

Amen to that.

[Coluber42]

Overhead dictates a lot of cost. Many people don't know or forget what is costs just to open the doors.

Retail is expensive, especially brick and mortar retail. Typical retail markup is 100% - in other words, the store sells the item for twice what they paid for it (or the distributor gives their retailers a 50%discount off the retail price, which is the same thing). But they aren't out to rip you off - most retail store owners are not rolling in it. And that is for inanimate products that don't need to be fed, cleaned, watered, quarantined, etc.
Maintaining a store that people can walk into and buy things requires paying for square footage in an area where people go to shop, and employees, and a good selection of stock, etc. Paying $100 for a normal that's healthy and well cared for, from a store that takes good care of their animals isn't so ridiculous even if you could get one for $20 from a breeder; you aren't paying the extra $80 for the snake per se. You're paying the extra for the convenience of being able to walk in off the street and buy the snake in person on the spot; and pick up your bedding and feeders and other stuff in the same place, and the instant gratification of having your purchases in hand right away.

If that's not worth the premium price to you, don't shop at a pet store. But don't expect the convenience/service of a brick and mortar store for the price of someplace with minimal overhead.

[se7en]

Retail is expensive, especially brick and mortar retail. Typical retail markup is 100% - in other words, the store sells the item for twice what they paid for it (or the distributor gives their retailers a 50%discount off the retail price, which is the same thing). But they aren't out to rip you off - most retail store owners are not rolling in it. And that is for inanimate products that don't need to be fed, cleaned, watered, quarantined, etc.
Maintaining a store that people can walk into and buy things requires paying for square footage in an area where people go to shop, and employees, and a good selection of stock, etc. Paying $100 for a normal that's healthy and well cared for, from a store that takes good care of their animals isn't so ridiculous even if you could get one for $20 from a breeder; you aren't paying the extra $80 for the snake per se. You're paying the extra for the convenience of being able to walk in off the street and buy the snake in person on the spot; and pick up your bedding and feeders and other stuff in the same place, and the instant gratification of having your purchases in hand right away.

If that's not worth the premium price to you, don't shop at a pet store. But don't expect the convenience/service of a brick and mortar store for the price of someplace with minimal overhead.

that's all stuff i have to take into consider, as i was kicking around the idea of opening my own pet store someday. might just run the business out of my home, which would save on said overhead costs, but limit the number of animals i could manage.

[PitOnTheProwl]

that's all stuff i have to take into consider, as i was kicking around the idea of opening my own pet store someday. might just run the business out of my home, which would save on said overhead costs, but limit the number of animals i could manage.

Don't forget local code enforcement and all the other red tape you will have to jump through. LoL

[CantHelpIt]

He seems quite healthy and plump so I doubt this would've ever turned into a horror story, but nice pickup. Thing is, he has been eating and eating well by the looks of it so the chain stores method of give them a frozen thawed rat once a week would have likely been just fine until someone like yourself picked him up.

The problem is when a snake isn't well started or can't handle the stress of the new environment, its never malicious with the intent to make the animal suffer, the employees simply lack the knowledge, initiative and time to try and get a picky feeder to start eating. Then one of us more knowledgeable owners comes in and sees them and off goes another tirade which everyone joins in on.
I've yet to see a malnourished sickly snake in a chain store near me, albeit I don't visit them often, but from the way I see it, its an uncommon situation when a snake doesn't adjust well and then we make it a big story. Exactly like people picking out the snake stories from a bad keeper to show the world how no one should keep these dangerous snakes.
Instead of coming on the internet to complain about it why not put together a proper care pamphlet, take it in and calmly explain why what they're doing is incorrect and how they can correct it. A simple, helpful explanation of why the care is inadequate will do tenfold more than screaming judgmental accusations of how they're torturing animals.
Anyways, sorry for going off-topic, its a beautiful snake and I'm sure they'll have a great life with you

[Jeanne]

Nice purchase, its a beautiful animal.

But most definately not what should be considered a rescue. That animal appears healthy, just has stuck shed, which likely was nothing more thn a humidity issue in its prior placment.

[se7en]

Don't forget local code enforcement and all the other red tape you will have to jump through. LoL