Super Cinnamon versus Eight ball?

[jplehmann]

I'm wanting to make the all black python, like the super cinny. Is there any difference between this and an eightball? (cinny x black pastel)? I want a cinny adult female, but have an opportunity to buy an adult black pastel female and want to know what the difference would be.

thanks!

[bcr229]

IIRC super cinny can be more of a dark brown than black, 8-ball is dark gray, super black pastel is darkest of the three combos.

Look at suma's (super mahogany) if you want a very dark or all black snake. I also don't think suma's have the potential for kinking issues that the cinny/black pastel combos do.

[kaylablack]

Hey Im not sure if you are aware of any lethal combos, but if your going for an all black snake, read up on super cinnys and super black pastels. Iv never worked with either but from the info thats out there the super forms produce duckbilling and rare kinks.
Its just something to look into. If you do a search you will find a ton of information.
I am not sure if Im allowed to post links but heres one anyways since its info people should recognize.

http://www.owalreptiles.com/issues.php

Kayla

[Eric Alan]

Hey Im not sure if you are aware of any lethal combos, but if your going for an all black snake, read up on super cinnys and super black pastels. Iv never worked with either but from the info thats out there the super forms produce duckbilling and rare kinks.
Its just something to look into. If you do a search you will find a ton of information.
I am not sure if Im allowed to post links but heres one anyways since its info people should recognize.

http://www.owalreptiles.com/issues.php

Kayla

Being that the owner of that site is a senior member on here, you're good with posting that link.

[OhhWatALoser]

Hey Im not sure if you are aware of any lethal combos, but if your going for an all black snake, read up on super cinnys and super black pastels. Iv never worked with either but from the info thats out there the super forms produce duckbilling and rare kinks.
Its just something to look into. If you do a search you will find a ton of information.
I am not sure if Im allowed to post links but heres one anyways since its info people should recognize.

http://www.owalreptiles.com/issues.php

Kayla

This forum is all about information sharing, not monetization. You can even post links to other forums if the info is relevant.

[Kyle21166]

So why does having a trait such as a kink or mild deformity get to having a bad breeding or that a cinnamon/black pastel breeding will have nothing but dead offspring. Such far fetch saying is why sadly things gain negative reputations. As the OWAL posting noted it is many desirable and daily bred snakes with out such negativity why spread false truths of morphs. Sad to say any and all snakes 4 gene will have kinks and deformities as well as any recessive so stop bad mouthing a specific morph. Such sad childish games.

[OhhWatALoser]

So why does having a trait such as a kink or mild deformity get to having a bad breeding or that a cinnamon/black pastel breeding will have nothing but dead offspring. Such far fetch saying is why sadly things gain negative reputations. As the OWAL posting noted it is many desirable and daily bred snakes with out such negativity why spread false truths of morphs. Sad to say any and all snakes 4 gene will have kinks and deformities as well as any recessive so stop bad mouthing a specific morph. Such sad childish games.

I am going to guess english is not your first language, but I couldn't understand what message you are trying to post.

[Stewart_Reptiles]

I'm wanting to make the all black python, like the super cinny. Is there any difference between this and an eightball? (cinny x black pastel)? I want a cinny adult female, but have an opportunity to buy an adult black pastel female and want to know what the difference would be.

thanks!

Super Cinny are dark brown not black, 8 Balls tend to be darker than Super Cinnies some even being black.

Obviously if you produce a 8 Ball this animal will produce both Black Pastels and Cinnamon.

Bottom line it's really a matter of personal preference, just like Black Pastels VS Cinnies, some people like Cinnies better some like Black Pastel Better.

[Aercadia]

I am going to guess english is not your first language, but I couldn't understand what message you are trying to post.

I'll take a stab at it... I play "decipher the jumble" all day at my job, I should be good at this ;)

So why does having a trait such as a kink or mild deformity get to having a bad breeding

Q: So, why do people think that breeding snakes with kinks or mild deformities will always turn out bad clutches?

A: Genetic deformities do not necessarily mean that a snake will fail to thrive. However, breeding snakes with genetic defects raises the odds of getting offspring with defects, so most breeders will select to remove those snakes from their breeding pool - in order to give future clutches the best chance of being healthy and viable, only healthy snakes without genetic defects contribute their genes.

or that a cinnamon/black pastel breeding will have nothing but dead offspring.

Q: Or, that pairings like Cinnamon x Black Pastel will always produce dead offspring?

A: You are probably referencing the Super Cinnamon x Super Black Pastel pairing notes (the pairing which produces 8-balls), which do not state that this is a fatal pairing, but that duckbilling and kinking are known to be reported from this particular pairing. You may be thinking of some other known pairings which have been recorded to yield primarily fatal results... the 8-ball pairing is not one of them.

Such far fetch saying is why sadly things gain negative reputations.

Q: Saying things like this is why people think breeding snakes is bad -or- why people think certain snakes are bad.

A: If by "people" you mean "people outside of the community, who have not done any research, and who are prone to think that snakes and/or breeders are bad stuff to begin with", then... maybe.

As the OWAL posting noted it is many desirable and daily bred snakes with out such negativity why spread false truths of morphs.

Q: According to the OWAL posting, there are lots of pairings that people do every day, that they apparently shouldn't do because of the bad outcomes, but enough of them come out fine, so why are you saying all these bad things about morphs that clearly aren't true?

A: Yes, people pair snakes every day... some people who have done their research, understand the risks, and are willing to give risky pairings a try to further the pool of data that we have already... some people who have done their research and understand that some "defects" are not life-threatening (bug eyes, small eyes, sex ratios, wobble) and do not affect future generations' ability to thrive... and some people who have done no research and just want to make some eggs. And results may vary.

Sad to say any and all snakes 4 gene will have kinks and deformities as well as any recessive so stop bad mouthing a specific morph.

Q: What people aren't talking about, is that all snakes with 4 genes or more will have genetic problems, and all recessive genes cause problems, so you should stop pointing out the negatives about just a few specific snakes - there are way more with problems that you're all admitting.

A: Well... we're open to new data, if you have proof to back up your claims. :) The OWAL list has come about with a lot of data to back up the claims there - these are well documented and known issues, and responsible enthusiasts and breeders keep an eye on arising problems and new information. If you have links for some studies to back up the claims that 4+ genes/all recessive genes cause problems, we'd be happy to review the data.

Such sad childish games.

​...I agree. ;)