How much line breeding is too much?

[nucklehead97]

I have a female het pied almost breeding size and a super pastel male that still has a couple years or so to get up to the weight I want him at before I breed so I have some time. But I wrote out what I want to do in ideal circumstances and there is a lot of line breeding back into both the original male and female. So how much is too much?

[nucklehead97]

Come one guys I need some help here. Or if there is somewhere you can direct me to an answer that helps too.

[Stewart_Reptiles]

There is no study that has been made on line breeding and when enough is enough, it could take 10/20/30 generations before something goes wrong just like it is possible that nothing goes wrong at all.

And of course there will be the people that will swear that it should never be done

[StormHerper]

Newb question....line breeding = inbreeding?

[Spoons]

Newb question....line breeding = inbreeding?

i'm only familiar with "line breeding" in the horse world, but with horses it is inbreeding given a fancy name to make it sound less like inbreeding. I don't know anything about breeding snakes, but I do think that inbreeding in any species can and will bring out genetic problems. I would be interested in hearing the discussion around it, if it happens.

[carbn8]

I might be wrong in this but isn't "line breeding" kind of a natural thing? Isn't that how locals were defined. For instance small island locals, given the limited number of blood lines in a small area its bound to happen, right.

[Spoons]

Natural doesn't mean okay or good, though. (Cyanide and Herpes are natural, too!) You are correct, small populations of people don't have a choice but to "linebreed" and because of that you hear the news stories of the small colonies of people that are riddled with birth defects and genetic problems from it. There was a recent one about that polygamist guy in Kentucky and his group of wives starting to see problems, I will see if I can find it later. People use it in animals to strengthen certain traits without considering the large number of problems that can come with it.

Edit to add: Here's a brief article about it in the Amish community, since they do not allow marriage outside of the Amish faith:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-.../1421049/posts

[Stewart_Reptiles]

Natural doesn't mean okay or good, though. (Cyanide and Herpes are natural, too!) You are correct, small populations of people don't have a choice but to "linebreed" and because of that you hear the news stories of the small colonies of people that are riddled with birth defects and genetic problems from it. There was a recent one about that polygamist guy in Kentucky and his group of wives starting to see problems, I will see if I can find it later. People use it in animals to strengthen certain traits without considering the large number of problems that can come with it.

Edit to add: Here's a brief article about it in the Amish community, since they do not allow marriage outside of the Amish faith:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-.../1421049/posts

You are comparing apple and oranges

Human complex DNA and Reptiles cannot be compared, just like there is a difference between mammals and reptiles.

Show me 1 study that shows that line breeding has caused major issues in reptiles.

[Spoons]

Here's one about sand lizards:
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...3564E15.f02t01

I see absolutely no reason why reptiles would be any different than any other animal. Yeah, they're a different type of animal with different genes, but crossing back those genes too much reliably causes problems.

I had another but it's behind a paywall, I will see if I can find it elsewhere when I get home

[carbn8]

I agree with Deborah, apples and oranges. With out " line breeding" we would have a much harder time proving out morphs. With out this natural "inbreeding" we would not have the any local specific animals. breeders have been doing it for years. this is also why we have blood line specific bp morphs. What breeders are doing with line breeding is not something un natural in it self, it's more at the pace in with it is done. We are talking about an animal that can produce viable eggs with out ever being introduced to a male. Now that's inbreeding