Setup Questions

[FVmike]

Hello everyone!

A little bit of background info:

At the end of the summer, I'm moving across the country to Arizona for graduate school. After I get settled in, I'm planning on buying my very first snake! I'm planning on getting a ball python at the Tucson reptile expo in October. I've been doing a lot of research; I want my snake to be happy and healthy, and as such, I have a few (okay, well more like a lot) of questions. I'll start by describing what my setup plan is, then provide some questions at the bottom.

The Supplies:
Tank:
NPI S36T

UTH:
Zoo Med UTH (15.5''x8'')

CHE:
Fluker's
Plus clamp lamp and lamp stand

Thermostat:
Herpstat 2

Thermometer/Hygrometer:
Was actually looking for a recommendation here.

Other tank stuff:
Repti-Carpets
2 Hides
Water Dish (heavy stone)


The Plan:
I'm planning on setting up my tank as follows:

- hot side: 90-92 , cool side 80-82, ambient: 80-82, humidity: 50-60%, 70% during shed
- UTH under hot side
- CHE for ambient temps
- Herpstat controlling UTH and CHE
- One hide one each side
- Water dish in the center
- Still not sure on thermometer/hygrometer placement, I'll have a more specific question in the next section.


The Questions:

General:

1) How are you doing today? :)
2) To my understanding, I need to measure hot side floor temp, cool side floor temp, ambient temp, and humidity. Is this right? How many thermometers would this require?

Supplies:

1) I'm not planning on getting a rack system, I only want one snake (for now). How should I mount this tank?
2) Is there a better tank out there that you would recommend? I want something with high visibility, but not a glass aquarium.
3) Which thermometer/hygrometer would you recommend? I know to stay away from analog and stick-ons, but apart from that, I'm not sure what to get. I've read reviews of some online, and it seems like a lot have major problems with accuracy, sometimes varying by 10 degrees, and 20~30% humidity!

Setup:

1) This kind of relates to General question #2, and you may have answered it already. In addition to the thermostat, which controls the amount of power to the UTH and CHE, thus regulating temps, do I also need to measure floor/ambient temps as a precautionary measure in case of failure?

2) Where should I put the CHE? From the pictures, it looks like my only two options with that particular tank are over the hot or cool side. I was planning on putting it over the center so that the ambient temps are more even throughout the tank, but this may not be an option.

3) How do you regulate cool side temps without using another UTH (which I'm told is overkill)?

4) If I have the UTH and CHE on the thermostat, where should I put the probes? I've heard under the substrate on the hot side or
between the UTH and the bottom of the tank. I'm planning on putting my ambient one in the center about halfway up the side of the tank, secured with hot glue.

5) Related to #4, It looks like there is nowhere to snake the probes into the tank with the one I've chosen. How would you accomplish this without drilling a hole in the tank?



That's all for now, thanks for hanging in!

[kitedemon]

Hi Mike I am well! Yourself?

Yes you should measure the three temps. I use one probed thermometer in the hot side hide this is fairly important temp. I use a second measuring ambient air temps. For the rest I run a IR thermometer (sometimes called an IR gun or non contact thermometer.) The cool side surface will usually be close to the air temp.

Yes monitoring in case of failure is very important. Every t-stat but the herpstats I recommend a second to act as a failsafe. To protect in case of failure. The mechanical relay many herpstats have calls this into question.

You will not be able to correctly regulate a UTH ad CHE on a single t-stat you need two or dual probes (HS2) to do this. PLEASE get the cage and everything set up in advance of the snake so you have time to tune it and get everything right with out running the risk of burns to the snake. Depending on the set up in some cases a fluorescent light and LED nigh lights will heat the air to hold correct ambient temps. They are safer cheaper and easier to run that a CHE I would suggest trying this first it is a small investment compared to a CHE and stat.

The best position for a THERMOSTAT probe is on the out side between the UTH and cage. There are other options but they should only be explored when this method fails to produce stable temps you will need to experiment before the snake arrives.

The THERMOMETER probes don't need to be secured they can wiggle around with no issues. I just use the suction cup on the inside of the hot hide and expect it to be mid 80s and check every day while setting up with an IR gun.

If you decide to secure the Thermometer probe do so with hot melt (no snake until it cools) and do the complete cable so the snake cannot get bound up in the loose middle with firmly fixed ends. Either loose or fixed not half way.

Drill with a new very sharp bit works just fine.

[FVmike]

First off, thanks for answering!

Hi Mike I am well! Yourself?

I'm fine, just finished moving out of my apartment, so kind of exhausted!

Depending on the set up in some cases a fluorescent light and LED nigh lights will heat the air to hold correct ambient temps. They are safer cheaper and easier to run that a CHE I would suggest trying this first it is a small investment compared to a CHE and stat.

Would I also set those lights on the thermostat? Or would regulating ambient temp with the, be more of a "turn on when too cold, turn off when too hot" dealie-o?

edit: Let's pretend that I have a thermostat with two probes, such as the herpstat 2.

[kitedemon]

No lights just go on a timer. I have a very cool room (>68) in the coolest part of the season I run the blue led 24/7 the fl 12/12
Spring/fall LEDs 12/12 same for fl
Summer LEDs 6/18 fl 4/20
Or so there is a long range on ambients so it is a big target. Personally I like 77-85 some say 75-88 I am conservative and stay with the majority.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[FVmike]

Ah, I see. Since I'm moving to a completely new region (from michigan), and have no idea what to expect temperature-wise, it sounds like I'll have to do some experimenting when I set up the tank (before I get the snake), to see what works and what doesn't. Thanks!

[whispersinmyhead]

Kitedemon has answered you setup questions very well. I can tell you that you will love haing a Herpstat. Easy to setup and just work well.

As for your cage I think that is a move looking cage. I would just put that on a table or build a stand if you handy with tools.

www.boaphileplastics.com/cages.html also has nice cages that would stack easily. You would have to cut a hole and secure some screen to it if ambient temps aren't high enough though. I would mount Deep Blue LED lights in it and put them in a timer though. They may provide enough heat to raise your ambients to the correct range. You could use a fluorescent for day time light as well and that would also raise you ambient. They would of course have to be mounted inside the cage which requires a little planning and searching for the right lights. Often we have to adapt everyday items to make our setups work. Pet stores rarely carry what we need (where I live at least). If mounting internal lights works for you then you have a cage that can stack just in case you want more than one. (They are quite addictive). The cage you found looks great but looks like it needs a special stand (expensive from the manufacturer). It will work fine for one and require less messing around.

CHE's do lower your humidity but substrates like cypress mulch or coco choir help battle that. That is why personally I would try to mount a little lighting inside. (No Tape inside the enclosure ever). Without the CHE you will have no issues with humidity. It will be easy to maintain.

[FVmike]

Thanks for the info!

As for your cage I think that is a move looking cage. I would just put that on a table or build a stand if you handy with tools.

Heh, I'm so not-handy with tools that if I were to try to build a stand I would somehow destroy the Eiffel Tower. I'm thinking I'll get my original choice for cage (though I really considered the one you linked, it was a tough choice), with a dual lamp vent installed. Then, I'll run a day/night bulb setup on a timer over the vent.


How do you regulate temp with the florescent bulbs? My guess is either you constantly are turning them on and off based on the temp, or you change the wattage of the bulb?

[whispersinmyhead]

They will bump your burnt temps up a few degrees. They aren't strong enough to over heat your enclosure so they won't have to be regulated aside from really hot days or something.

If you go with your original choice you just won't bs able to stack but in return you will be able to regulate you ambient temps with CHE's or bulbs. You also won't have to modify the cage aside much of at all. You will have to be careful with humidity though. I used Cypress mulch when I se a CHE and I had no problems at all with humidity. I had to dampen it once or twice a week. You will know when you start setting up you enclosure. Make sure you have it up a week before getting you ball python so it is 100% ready.


You know yourself better than we do. I built an enclosure out of oak ply and a matching stand. It was beautiful but now I sold that and I built a rack. My two new snakes are coming tomorrow morning! I know that I have a bit of an addictive personality so I held off the urge but only lasted a year.

I am very happy to see you choosing suitable enclosures. Glass tanks can work but these are much better.

Please remover to post pics of your new baby when you get it and your setup!