Narrow minded or am I asking too much?

[covah-pariah]

So I called a herp hobby shop a bit ago and explained my snake saliva project and asked if he would be willing to let me come swab the mouth of some of his BP's to determine what bacteria are present in the saliva. I explained I've already done this to one of mine and the swab is harmless to the snake, and that mine had E. coli in its saliva. He kinda freaked out saying I need to contact the CDC because of that and thought it was contagious. He first said no to it cause he didn't want to hurt his snakes by breaking a tooth or infecting their mouths, or get them sick because mine "has E. coli". I tried to explain they won't get an infection because it's a sterile swab, it won't pull any teeth, and not all E. coli is pathogenic. He told me he wasn't comfortable with me doing it and to contact a vet or go to Busch Gardens (Tampa), so I apologized that he wasn't willing to help increase the knowledge of BP's. He did invite me to come talk in person and try to explain more, so I may be able to after all.
What do you all think, am I asking too much?

-Rich

[Andybill]

Go see him and take some swabs with you and you may get lucky. I dont think you are asking too much...

[Poseidon]

Go talk to him. Tell him that E. coli is actually very common in the lower digestive track of mammals. You really need to use layman's terms with him. It would benefit you to explain bacteria's role in animals and that it isn't always harmful.

[kitedemon]

I seems quite reasonable. I might in future just state that you are doing a study of bacterium in Royal's mouths and leave what bacteria out.

[wolfy-hound]

While what you're asking seems perfectly reasonable, there's nothing wrong with him saying "No, you can't swab my snakes' mouths."

Think about from his view... where a total stranger calls you up and wants to test your snakes to show that they have E. coli bacteria in their mouths. I sure wouldn't want my business to be known to have snakes that carry E. coli.... bad press. And if you have E. coli, maybe you pass it to MY snakes... then my snakes, me, or family gets sick, because of course E. coli is bad stuff.

The fact that he said you can come talk to him shows he's not "narrow minded" at all. He's thinking of his BUSINESS and his animals first, AS HE SHOULD BE. He doesn't know that you're not some Animal Planet whack job looking to shut down all pet stores or looking to get proof that no one should own snakes, etc.

Go talk to him, show him the swabs, explain how it may be helpful. Because just showing that some/all snakes have E. coli in their mouths is NOT going to be helpful in any way to the common herper... and could be harmful to the hobby. Show him why you want to do this, how it's beneficial. If it's just "Gee, I wanna know", don't expect a ton of help.

Above all else, remember that he doesn't have any obligation to allow you access to his snakes. If he does allow you to take swabs, he's doing YOU a favor.

[WingedWolfPsion]

Everyone realizes, don't they, that humans also have e-coli in their mouths?

[Vypyrz]

Everyone realizes, don't they, that humans also have e-coli in their mouths?

Where's my Listerine?

I agree with the post above. Don't tell them what you are looking for specifically, only that you are trying to get samples from various sources to make comparisons. After you finish with your BP bacteria study, maybe you could collect sample from other species of snakes and reptiles, and compare them to the Ball Pythons to see if there are any common bacteria or if it is just BP specific...

[prettyballsy]

I agree with what you're hearing from everyone else. Go talk to him in person. Unfortunately, its probably the mention of E Coli that set him off. With all the talk of super bugs these days its easy for people to go into panic mode.

[covah-pariah]

He was already apprehensive about me doing it before I even mentioned the E. coli, and it took me some convincing for him to even invite me to talk in person. I'll admit that this first started off as just curious but after I found nothing about it online I decided to make it an actual project to propose to the academic chair at my school for an undergrad research project. I'm also planning to present what I've found up to that point in a research conference in Oct. After I've completed all of this, I may even try to publish a paper on it.

Teresa, not all E. coli is pathogenic and bad. the strain in their mouth is probably there to start breaking down the food or it could be from the rat, that's what I'm trying to find out. I'm not in any way trying to do anything that would hurt this amazing hobby, and I don't think doing this research would. There is minimal data out there that stops at determining its a gram negative bacteria, but the saliva in cats and dogs have been characterized completely. In fact, I believe this research could actually HELP our hobby! If you compared it to other common domestic house pets and the BP safer compared to other animals then maybe more people would get them.

-Rich

[prettyballsy]

Good luck with your project and publishing your paper. I hope you're able to get his cooperation!