Poll: Rep system...is it flawed?

[dr del]

Hi,

Ok. I have just spent an hour or two wading through old threads to try and work out why the system is set up the way it is and made a few discoveries.

The main one being this is what the members told us they wanted the last time we asked.

Oh look - a member poll.

Note the date of the poll - almost two years ago. The actual date that the thanks system first linked with the rep system seems to have been at some slightly earlier point in 2009 ( probably a trial period ) but I can't narrow it down exactly yet. The thanks system seems to have been introduced in November 2007.

Members then complained it was getting used instead of the rep button and they were never getting any points. We tried making larger, more noticeable rep buttons ( something we lost in the last board upgrade ) but it didn't really seem to make a great deal of difference.

This was why thanks was tied to the reputation system. Because the members wanted it to be.

We considered removing the tanks system completely but nobody seemed to like that idea either when we asked.

There are also limitations within the software itself that set limits on what we can and cannot set up in terms of scaling rep etc.

On your suggestion we modify members rep to match thanks given before it was linked to the reputation system.

There are 17,763 registered users and 588 veterans at least ( there are quite a few other usergroups affected but those are the main two ) - do you really expect us to manually check and edit each one that joined before the change was introduced?!

Because manually is the only way to do it.

And of course even if we do that would be unfair on the earlier members who didn't get to take advantage of the thanks system when they were earning their rep.

There is no perfect system that I know of. If you know of one shout out.

Just pointing out something isn't perfect isn't all that helpfull unless you also have ideas on how to fix it.


dr del

[JLC]

If its based off "thanks" why do I have 3 bars and Jerhart has 2, but hes got more thanks than me.

Because tying "reputation" points to the Thanks system is a relatively recent phenomenon. I don't remember exactly when we did that, but it was sometime in the last couple of years. So someone like Jerhart, who participated a lot in his earlier years, but not so much in recent years may have a lot of "older thanks" in his count than a newer member.


I DO understand a bit of frustration that old thanks don't affect your rep score. I'm very sorry there's nothing we can do about that. We can't retroactively go back and award reps for old thanks. We have twenty THOUSAND members! I'm sorry, but we've got far more important issues and projects on our plate than going back and changing something that was never that important to begin with.

Nothing will probably be done...again.

Out of this whole thing, THIS is the statement that I don't understand. You imply that we never change anything or fix anything or ever work with our membership to make the site better for them? The "rep" system has gone through numerous changes over the years to make it as fair as possible for the membership. I'm not going to go through the whole history because I don't have time to. You can mine through the histories if you like.

The most recent change was adding a point of rep to the Thanks button...because for whatever reason, the old, original rep system had fallen into much disuse and members were getting frustrated at their inability to gain new points despite how much help they offered. A VOTE was taken among the entire membership asking if they wanted to add a rep point to the "thank you" button. Guess what? The majority of members thought that would be a good idea. So we went with it.

Members who have been around for years and have had solid participation in the site are not "rewarded" with reps....they're rewarded with the Veteran status, which gives them some extra perks with their account here. I'm sorry if that's not good enough. I'm really not sure what else I can do.

No, the rep system isn't "flawless". If you can tell me HOW to make it so...both theoretically and in a manner that our system software will allow...I'm willing to consider ideas to make it better. But the entire system is something of a whimsy in the first place and is not real high on the totem pole of priorities for us to spend a great deal of time "perfecting."

[Jerhart]

Judy,

I apologize for that statement. I know that the mods give up their personal free time to moderate the boards to get them to run smoothly. That was a simple case of not thinking before I type. I apologize again.

I just feel, along with others, that the system can be improved as it does not portray what, I feel, is the intent of the system. Derrick made some relevant points and if I come up with any ideas of how to improve the system within its capabilities, I will

The "thanks" I feel is what somewhat throws the system off. I know it was suggested in the pass, but maybe it isn't tied to the rep. It doesn't count towards anything other than a "thanks" count.

[JLC]

Apology accepted. Thank you.

I know it was suggested in the pass, but maybe it isn't tied to the rep. It doesn't count towards anything other than a "thanks" count.

It was just so the first couple of years that we had the feature. And the moment it was installed, an already pretty slow rep-gaining process turned glacial. So we mixed it up and added a point of rep to the thanks button. Now folks can actually SEE progress in their rep score.

Which way is better? I seriously believe there is no right answer. No matter what we do, someone will say it's not "fair" and won't be happy with it. And...if we suddenly turned off that rep point tied to the thanks button...everyone who signs up in the future will be tied to the glacially slow system while their peers who've been here longer have tons of rep due to old thanks. And we'd be having this whole argument all over again.

[mainbutter]

I've never really thought about it much before, but how many people come to their computer saying "I'm going to play some BP.net the video game, I have to get to a new reputation level!"?

Any system can be gamed, the one we have for reputation is fine IMO. IN GENERAL, people who get more thanks, answer more questions, post more pictures, and are well-liked get more reputation points (from what I can tell). On a forum, any reputation system really is just a popularity contest.

If anyone wants serious feedback regarding the possibility of spending large amounts of money on animals, there's better resources available. Not only that, but basing a monetary decision on some green boxes is silly, reading direct reports of interactions with sellers/buyers is the best way to go.

I need to drool over more snake pictures now, that's my favorite part about snake forums
ttyl.

[OhhWatALoser]

What if in certain sub forums the reputation wasn't effected by thanks, like the picture galleries?

[wilomn]

Any of you guys have teachers that gave you stickers when you were in first or second grade? Did those stickers have any real value outside the classroom? Did they make a difference in the real world? Did you get them simply for participating as well as achievement? Once you realized that cute as they were they had no real value did you feel sad? Cheated? Ready to play on the swings because you never bothered to think of them past the -wow what a pretty sticker- part of having stickers at all?

Did you pine for stickers? Long for them? Plan nefarious deeds in order to obtain them, to possess them, to hold them shiny and bright in your very own hands?

Seriously, they're stickers that we get for participating and occasionally achieving something cool; picture, clutch, cleverly worded diatribe, etc. etc. etc.

Sometimes, not always but sometimes, a thing is just what it seems to be. The greenies are just a way for others to be nice to you. Either be nicer, grow a tougher skin, or alter you perceptions of what is important.

[JLC]

What if in certain sub forums the reputation wasn't effected by thanks, like the picture galleries?

The software isn't that sophisticated. It's either on...or off.

[SlitherinSisters]

See look, even Wilomn has a lot of rep points. JK Wilomn

I definitely agree with this.

Either be nicer, grow a tougher skin, or alter you perceptions of what is important.

The rep points aren't important, plain and simple. They are just a fun way to earn "credit" for contributing to the site IMO. A lot of the thanked posts can hardly be considered meaningful to the BP world. Being thanked for saying "that snake is hot" is nothing more than a credit/reward for being involved. Generally if you are friendly and give advice without attitude you will be thanked. If that's not your cup of tea, then my advice (to anyone) is to forget about the rep points.

And as it was stated by the admins, there really isn't much tweaking that can be done. Basically we have the rep points or we don't. Getting rep for thanked posts is flawed no doubt, but what do the points really matter? Just because you have lots of green squares doesn't mean people will like you. We are all aware that some people play the system a bit by giving/receiving thanks on just about everything, but it's not going to last forever. Those people will get bored and find a new site to tool around on eventually.

[Jerhart]

Never did I receive stickers as a child, I was one of those other kids. However, I did work at the soup kitchen at the local homeless shelter during the holidays with my church. I didn't receive stickers...but it was the right thing to do.