Don't judge me!!!!

[hoax]

Ok so this was a stupid title but I could not think of what else to call it.

So to the point. I just read a thread about vet bills and stuffs.

I answered from the heart then I thought about it and came up with an answer from the brain.

From a collector/pet point of view it would make sense to spend what ever it takes to get the animal back to health if it is possible.

From a breeder point of view... A not so popular point of view. Obviously depending on the rarity of the animal and likely hood of it being a viable breeder, I do not think it would be prudent to spend more then the value of the animal. What do you think and don't just answer think about your answer from both as a collector and lover of these animals and from a money/breeder point of view.

Mike

[frankykeno]

A good thread and an interesting topic Mike, I do hope you don't mind if I stuff my nose into it LOL

For me, maybe because I'm an old broad with a load of common sense, or that I grew up around farmers and hunters but I have a view of the place animals hold in my life that isn't always popular. I love the animals but in the end, whether as a pet owner or a breeder/collector, they remain "in their place". The needs of my family are first, the needs of the whole collection has to be, for me, more important than the needs of a single animal if the costs of vet care for that animal would place me in a position of being unable to properly provide for those that depend on me.

I also take into consideration the quality of life vs simply getting more days counted off. I've had very old cats and dogs that simply needed the rest and that last trip to the vet. I could have chosen expensive surgeries but without any real promise of a painfree life for my aged pets, I chose to honor the time we'd had and not prolong it because I couldn't face their loss.

I do have snakes in the collection that may never breed. The spider from Tim being a good example. Grace may not be breedable and that's okay. We made the choice when we offered to take her, knowing her full medical background. That's a personal choice thing from the heart and we can afford to keep her regardless of her genetic potential.

All this babble basically means I guess that I'll always take a very common sense approach to the snakes when hard decisions must be made. Some are just not viable, some you can save, some you likely cannot. Being level headed about that, taking the whole picture into account is what I personally strive to do. Sure I may go off and have a good cry about it in private at some point, I've a very tender heart but in the end the decisions Mike and I make will be ones we are comfortable with.

[West Coast Jungle]

Very intersting point Mike. I dont know what to put in the poll because I am a collector but I also breed. Now I dont breed for $ like a business because if that was the case i would be loosing $ hand over fist and be out of business. I love working with these animals and have my own contracting business which is how I support my family and my animal collection. If I can make some extra bucks to support my hobby, more power to me. But from an investment point of view, I am loosing my ass, but I dont care or look at it that way.

I agree with Jo, I have spent many hundreds on vet bills for snakes that dont make me a dime. I think when you have any captive or domestic animal you take a responsibility for that animals well being. But the well being of my family and myself is my ultimate responsibility and priorities must be set.

Many years ago we had a dog (Taylor,a mini schnuazer)that at the age of 2 started having clusters of seizure (10 at a time) poor thing looked like it was on its death bed. Well my wife was so upset when this happened she thought we should put him down. I grew up with a brother that had seizures and obviously my parents treated him as best as medicine could. I said I was not going to give up on him just yet. The vet bills got a little hairy and I was faced with the fact that I may need to put him down because at the time I just couldnt afford treatments. He would have to go to the vet and get a shots of valium every time he had an episode. Well thanks to the internet we found out we could give him the medication rectally, the vet had not idea this could be done, and that saved us a significany amount of $ as we could do that ourselves. We then were referred to another vet who said he also had thyroid problems changed all his medications and that dog lived to 14 not having seizures for over 10 years.

If you approach snakes as an investment than you will make a decision based on $. If you keep snakes because you love animals than you will probably do what you can in your power to help them.

I brought up my dog Taylor because I belive in karma to the point that for every action there is a reaction. If you try to do the right thing to the best of your abilities(that is different for everyone) than the right things usually happen in return, even if that result is not felt or noticed immediately.

Getting back to vet visits, although they cost me alot of $ treating some sick snakes I learned alot about how to care for these animals better and I did loose one snake(albino) that I paid alot of $ for(back in the day). The knowledge I gained from treating and learning about these guys is worth more than any vet bill. I even have done telephone/internet appointments with Dr. Stahl in Maryland(the best!) to check on an animal, that ended up being fine, but if I didnt spend the $ I wouldnt have that knowledge and experience I now have gained. My collection is way better off(and myself) for going the extra mile and learning from those who know alot more than I did.

In the end the reason my snakes were getting RI's was not because of temps like most people would assume. I kept mine spot on. The problem was we have forced air heating in my house which blows hot dry air, complicate that with where I live (desert conditions) and these guys were getting blasted with hot nasty dry air and when winter hit the snakes at the top of the rack(closest to the heating vent) were getting respitory irritations leading to RI's. It was also causing me to have sinus problems, what must it be doing to an animal that lives in a dirt hole in humid Africa. I havent had any problem for years since making a minor adjustment.

My point you take care of them and it comes back to you. I now have experience and knowledge on how to treat sick snakes(how to give shots, do cultures etc..) that I can share and help others with and have very happy healthy critters in my collection.

Hindsight it was $ well spent even if friends and family (wife)thought it was rediculous spending that much cash helpng a snake.

[Slim]

Well Mike, as you well know, I'm a collector and have no breeding plans of my own. Right now I own nothing more expensive than a Co-Dom, but that will change this summer. Were one of my boys need extensive Vet care with the associated cost, I would pay what I could to make it happen...might even get a litte creative about how to come up with more, but wouldn't take food out of the twins mouths to pay anything it cost. At a certain point, you have to face the reality of the situation.

I'm also a big quality of life kind of guy, so that would have to factor into the equation.

[hoax]

Hey guys I am going to move this over to the BP section. The reason I did not post it over there is I was afraid I would get some nasty results...

I was afraid that people would not really "think" about what I was saying and just get all pissy.

Mike

[iCandiBallPythons]

As long as it can have a fairly normal life, I would do whatever I needed to do to make it happen. I cant really compare money cost of a vet bill to the animals I have because to me they are priceless. I see it this way... I am the one that obtained them and that puts me fully responsible to them to provide them nothing less than the best at all cost period. Thats just the standard I hold myself personally to.

[BPHERP]

There are business decisions...

There are personal decisions...

These being the case, every decision made on this topic would probably contain a certain % of each, which, in the end, should determine what you actually do.

BrandonsBalls

[ChristinaP]

It depends on the situation but I said no because if I'm spending TONS of money in vet bills, chances are the animal is very very sick. I couldn't stand to see it if it's hurt or in pain. I would have it put to sleep. I don't know what they do with snakes, but we had our 5 year old dog put to sleep after her Chemo didn't work. They would have to do surgery to remove her back 2 legs, and part of her intestines. There was no value of life after that. It would be t he same with my snake. If he wouldn't have a value of life after than no. If he did than yes.

[vangarret2000]

I think a lot (but not all of it) depends on the emotional attachment to it. If a pet of mine is new I think it would be easyer for me to let it go. BUt if I have had it for a period of time i think it would be harder to not see a vet. For me it would also depend on the amount for the vet bill. Even if it was high, if I could afford it I probably would. IF it was extremly high, I probably wouldn't be able to bring myself to do it even if I wanted and could afford too. To me, to pay more to heal an animal is ok but to pay a ridiculas amount, above the cost of a new animal, doesn't seem right. I know most people will think I am cruel for saying this. I kinda feel like I am a bad person for saying it, but truthfully that is how I feel. But again the more emotionally attached I am to an animal the more amount I would pay to see a vet.

[vangarret2000]

THinking more into it, right now I haven't had my snake for very long. RIght now if it was sick and I was told it would cost like $800-$1000 to heal it I wouldn't do it. But 5, 10, or 15 years from now. I could see myself mabey doing it. Again I just say mabey becuase I have never really been in that situation. But I think after having that long of a connection to my animal I would want it to live if possible.

The only time I have had to take a pet to the vet was a hampster late last year. It was sick right from the day I got it. He had wet tail. (I didn't know that when I bought it of course). I called every vet in town. The cheapest vet said I would have to pay him $60 just so he could tell me it had wet tail even though I already knew that is what it was, and then it would cost about $30-$40 to medicate and take care of it. ANd every vet said after all of it he could still die. SO in my head it was $100 to MAYBEY save my pet that costs about $15. I just couldn't bring myself to do it. I hated myself and cried many times for not doing it, but I could not spend that amount of money to save a hampster. Instead I got the advice from someone who bred hampsters and delt with wet tail before. She told me how to treat it and after acouple weeks both of us thought he was getting better, and for a couple days he seemed like he was back to normal health, and then he was just dead.

But that also was jsut a hampster. I would pay more to see a vet for my snake then I would for a hampster.