The market for new codoms....Up or Down? What your thoughts...

[Eyeball]

Well let me start by saying i have the utmost faith in this industry. I also own over thirty balls personaly and have several clutches cookin as we speak. With that said ive been keepin boids for 12 years, ive lurked in the shadowes most of that time and this is my first offical post on any forum. I was speaking with a friend yesterday on the current state of the market and this is the conclution that we came to.....The recessive market will be strong for years to come, its along time berore pieds,clowns,lavenders and that such stuff will be three hundred dollars. This friend recently acuired two very rare recessive morphs one of them being an Ultramel for under Five thousand dollars, this is in my opinion a great deal for a homozygos animale of that rearity. At VPI the barkers are selling their new Black azanthic at around 3,000 each. This brings me to my final question, the Mystic is listing at 3,250, the Phantom is at 5,000, the Paint ball and Black head are some where in the range of Three to Five thousand as well. So are codoms that will be reproduced much faster when let out on to the open market,keep in mind this price is for the base codom not the super form, are they realy worth the same price as some of the much rarer recessive morphs like the Black azanthic and the Ultramel,You pay the same price and you get a homozygos recessive that will be slower to recreate and hold its value in a more stable and much slower rate of decline. Simple economics....just wanted to hear you guys/gals thoughts. Thanks for reading and best regards, Eyeball

[tonkatoyman]

People can theorize all day but it boils down to "they are worth what people will pay for them". Mine are worth millions to me but I can only sell them for what people are willing to pay. If they can get that for them then I say more power to them

[wolfy-hound]

I think the market for NEW co-doms would be good, IF it's a remarkable co-dom. A co-dom that looks nearly identical to a normal, and has not proven a super, won't sell all that well, comparatively speaking IMHO.

I do think the days of a $100K for the latest morph are gone. Unless someone hatches/imports something REALLY amazingly different and proves it genetic, I doubt we'll see any heyday prices. But any new co-doms would be pretty sought after still, although it might take a little longer to get the good price, I think the seller would eventually get what they wanted.

[cinderbird]

I think the breeding part of the hobby needs to start going in a different direction. Prices are what they are. Some people find the deal of the century for an animal just to get (whatever) morph into their collection, some people pay 2x or more "list" value to find THE animal that they want for their collection. I think its nice that average income people can afford to get nice looking animals and morphs. I know if i got into this hobby years ago when i first wanted to, i could never afford anything.

I know, that I have been looking for above average to absolutely outstanding animals to keep and breed. I want to breed for looks, color, pattern, etc. Things that we can predict and enhance through selective breeding. There are a ton of browned out pastels out there, i don't want to create more average or poor morph examples, i want to create amazing animals that turn peoples heads.

That said, i dont even own an animal that is at breeding size (so close) . Im working on raising my snakes, getting to know them and their needs (even better than i already do) before venturing into breeding anything.

[kthulhu]

I think buying codoms is a bit of a risk just because they are so much easier to reproduce compared with recessives. So a three thousand dollar snake might come down in price alot faster if its a codom. That being said, I think alot of it has to do with whomever is in charge of the project. There are some people who prove a snake to be at lease dominant and put it right out in the market. It probably won't fetch as much money as it could just because people might not be willing to take the risk of buying an animal only to find out that there is no super. There are also some people who will buy a single male and breed him to 10 normals and before you know it, supply way exceeds demand. Good breeders are the ones who take the time to prove it out and see if the new gene fits well in combos before introducing the snake into the market. So while the codom market will inevitably go down in price quicker than with recessives, I think alot of it also has to do with the people working with those animals and how responsible they want to be with controlling how fast the prices will decline.

[pavlovk1025]

There are also some people who will buy a single male and breed him to 10 normals and before you know it, supply way exceeds demand.

Hell yes I agree. You see a lot of people with like a spider and a pastel male and like 8 normal females. Money is the drive not the possibility of creating something amazing.

[Eyeball]

Thanks for all your thoughts and coments, but i think the main theme of my post is being missed. What makes a codom which is a VISUAL HET (ie.Phantom) worth more than a MUCH MUCH rarer recessive morph(ie. Black Azanthic) which is a HOMOZYGOS animal that took twice as long to make and there is only mabe ten in the world. That is like sayin my pastels are worth more than someone elses albinos. The sounder project is in the recessive because is will hold water long after the codom of the month has sprung a leak. Not sayin i dont love codoms cause i do but i wouldent invest in a codom if i can buy a rarer recessive at the same price,that tells me that the codom is over priced and the market is going to fall two times faster on the codom than it will on the recessive. OH ya and sorry if i steped on any ones toes by using their morph as an example, its just an example . i have the utmost respect to the breeders workin to prove new codome and id like to own a paint ball and a blackhead my self as soon as i can but ive spent WAY OVER my limit this year on recessives and my wife is already pissed at me.LOL. Thanks for reading and best regards, Eyeball

[Python Dreams]

Its not really fair to compare the price of the base co-dom morph to that of the visual recessive morph... That base co-dom will still produce a Super the same way a Het will produce a visual recessive... That Super form will also be a way to continue making money on your investment and is just as hard to produce as the visual recessive... Seems like a no-brainer to work with visual Hets while also being able to produce a Super.
Take Albinos and Pastels for example... When comparing an Albino to a Pastel you would see a rapid drop in price... But when you compare Het Albinos to Pastels, the Pastels will draw a little more money while at the same time being easier to sell due to the Pastels being visual and not requiring faith that the breeder is telling the truth! When you compare the Super Pastel to the Albino, the Super Pastel still gets a bit more money, and again produces visual morphs as opposed to normal looking snakes that require faith in the breeder.
To ignore the Super form of the co-dom traits is automatically making your argument for recessives stronger, while down playing the true power of the co-dom!

[ang3l3s]

that was a really cool way of looking at and it actually make sense.

[stefanivanski]

Being In Canada man, Prices are almost always more (by a fare bit most times, I might add) then in the states. god do I wish I could buy snakes from down there.