What is it?

[dr del]

Hi,

Thank you.


dr del

[Ben Biscy]

Try looking at the snake in the picture.

It's NOT a black rat.

try a trip to the carolinas. that IS a black rat snake.

sorry wilomn, you're wrong this time buddy

[SerpentesCiconii]

Baby racers go through on ontogenetic shift. They start out with a blotched pattern before transitioning into their solid adult colors. Anyone claiming it is a black rat has obviously never seen a baby racer.

And what does him being from California have to do with his ability to ID snakes?

[wilomn]

try a trip to the carolinas. that IS a black rat snake.

sorry wilomn, you're wrong this time buddy

SonnyJim, I ain't the mistaken one here.

I've kept and bred black rats. I have yet to see one other than the one YOU posted here.

But you go right on ASSuming you're right.

It won't be the first time someone has made that error.

[Ben Biscy]

Baby racers go through on ontogenetic shift. They start out with a blotched pattern before transitioning into their solid adult colors. Anyone claiming it is a black rat has obviously never seen a baby racer.

And what does him being from California have to do with his ability to ID snakes?

how about the locale? the fact that they are common where they are indigenous? i've seen literally thousands of rats and racers, babies and adults.


racers, both blue and black have red patterned markings as babies. rats are black/blueish and silver/white.

want to try again?

[Ben Biscy]

SonnyJim, I ain't the mistaken one here.

I've kept and bred black rats. I have yet to see one other than the one YOU posted here.

But you go right on ASSuming you're right.

It won't be the first time someone has made that error.

tell you what sir; i have babies right now. i'll take a picture of a baby black rat from my collection for your comparison.

and i don't assume, i just know when i'm right and not egotistical enough to think that applies 100% of the time...

[wilomn]

Arrogance, sweet, sweet arrogance....

I'm pretty sure that Nashville is someplace in Tennessee.

According to guys who should know, http://www.tennsnakes.org/, the black rat doesn't even occur in that state.

IF you would look at the eye in the first picture and then at the eye of whatever you're calling a black ratsnake I bet a smart observant guy like you will have NO difference seeing THE difference. Count a few scales too, that might give you another indication that things may not be as you think they are.

[Little B-Py]

kinda didn't mean for this to become a heated debate...just curiosity...either way I let the snake go the next day in my back yard. Hopefully it hasn't drown in all the rain we have been having.

[wilomn]

kinda didn't mean for this to become a heated debate...just curiosity...either way I let the snake go the next day in my back yard. Hopefully it hasn't drown in all the rain we have been having.

No worries. It's just a game we boys sometimes play.

Be nice to have an actual challenge every once in a while though....

[Ben Biscy]

Arrogance, sweet, sweet arrogance....

I'm pretty sure that Nashville is someplace in Tennessee.

According to guys who should know, http://www.tennsnakes.org/, the black rat doesn't even occur in that state.

IF you would look at the eye in the first picture and then at the eye of whatever you're calling a black ratsnake I bet a smart observant guy like you will have NO difference seeing THE difference. Count a few scales too, that might give you another indication that things may not be as you think they are.

what is this link?

black rats are the MOST seen snake in north and south carolina. the locals (aka, the ignorants) call them "black snakes". any snake that is black is a black snake.... so i can see how someone who would reference a Tennessee site/chart as the "all southeastern nonvenomous snakes" would have similar thoughts.

similar, yes. but not quite; color is the number one give away. five minutes on a yahoo search will show you what i'm talking about. don't check one site, check many and see comparisons from different states, esp sc and ga.

you'll find that rat snakes are VERY common in the area (red, yellow, black), much less than the black/blue racer, which is found more north, ie nc, tn, va.... we've got the racers too, but you don't see them very often. you're more likely to stumble upon a coachwhip than a racer.

but yeah; check the coloration of baby vs. baby. then go to counting scales and posting links.

and to the other poster, yeah; all in good fun . i like arguing with wilomn, it's entertaining and great stress relief.