Up to size???

[Mitch21]

Hey all,

With everyone now talking about this year's breeding season being upon us, I thought I would try to figure out when my pastel girl would be ready. She was born July 7 of this past summer. She currently weighs 250grams. I was just trying to run some quick calculations to see if she would possibly be up to size by next breeding season...

She's growing at a minimum rate of 90grams per month. And if I decide to attempt to breed her when she weighs 1500grams, that gives me almost 14months from now to get her up to size with my current progression. I'm not power feeding her at all... I give her one adult mouse every 5 days... I'm guessing that as she gets bigger, she will put on some weight a little more quickly mainly because she will be fed bigger mice. So maybe in about 12-13 months she will be up to size. Now this is all hypothetical if everything works out as I have projected. If she's not up to size, then I'm not going to breed her next season...

But my main question is:

Is it possible for a female to get up to size in about a year a half?

[Gloryhound]

Yes they can reach breeding weight, but from our experience rats are the best way to get them there. Also not every snake will make it. Some slow down in growth cycles and they can misteriously go off feed for some unknown reason. Just keep feeding her and hope for the the best.

[andwhy6]

most are ready at about their 2nd winter. let the waiting begin

[nevohraalnavnoj]

Hey all,

With everyone now talking about this year's breeding season being upon us, I thought I would try to figure out when my pastel girl would be ready. She was born July 7 of this past summer. She currently weighs 250grams. I was just trying to run some quick calculations to see if she would possibly be up to size by next breeding season...

She's growing at a minimum rate of 90grams per month. And if I decide to attempt to breed her when she weighs 1500grams, that gives me almost 14months from now to get her up to size with my current progression. I'm not power feeding her at all... I give her one adult mouse every 5 days... I'm guessing that as she gets bigger, she will put on some weight a little more quickly mainly because she will be fed bigger mice. So maybe in about 12-13 months she will be up to size. Now this is all hypothetical if everything works out as I have projected. If she's not up to size, then I'm not going to breed her next season...

But my main question is:

Is it possible for a female to get up to size in about a year a half?

Keep in mind that growth is not linear. Depending on the prey size and where they are in their life cycle their growth rate will differ. You could approximate it by saying they grow really fast right away and then slow down (exponential growth, and then logarithmic). Some breeders try to avoid this and make the growth linear by making sure they are not over feeding.

Yes, it is possible to get females to breed in their second winter. I had one experienced breeder tell me that his success rate with females in their 2nd winter was 10% and his success rate with 3rd winter or older females was 90%. So even if she is "big" she's more like a fat teenager than an adult, and I know I'm stretching with that analogy. The point is, even if she's big it's still going to be difficult.

Consider things in the long term. The Barkers in their book repeatedly stress how much better it is to wait at least until the 3rd (or 4th) winter for females to ensure big clutch sizes throughout the life of the animal. I don't recall if it's in their book, but I recall hearing that breeding a female too soon can stunt their long term production.

Finally, she may slow down when she hits about 1000 grams. My used to be best eater is now finicky, whereas another one has really taken off once she hit 1000 grams. I think it's hard to say. So even if she looks like she's going to hit the mark, it's hard to say what she'll do next spring/summer.

In short, I wouldn't really worry about it right now. Just enjoy your ball python!

JonV

[nevohraalnavnoj]

Also, this thread had a very nice graphic on ball python growth provided by Staci (Icatsme)


http://www.ball-pythons.net/forums/s...147#post791147

JonV

[Mitch21]

Thanks everyone...

Jon, the analogy you brought up makes a lot more sense to me... Thanks for that!

[Somed00d]

I would get her eating rats as soon as possible. it may be hard to switch her to rats when she is eating 5 mice at a shot.

I don't think she will gain 90g per month consistently. I have a normal male that eats like a garbage disposal (he gets fed last and takes the rats that would otherwise go to the garbage) He has only gained 400g in 7 months. that's under 60g a month and he is getting fed very well.


Richard

[greghall]

She will most likely go off feed at sometime,it gets frustrating when they stop eating & growing its tough to wait for them to grow.I have a female early 07 that is almost 1000g & is a mouser deciding weather or not to breed her this year She is 100% het albino & my male is growing fast & over 500g he is albino.

[Mitch21]

I would love to get her on rats because of how nutritious I hear they are compared to mice. My only problem is that my pastel is super picky and only eats live, so that takes the euthanizing option. Do you think I can successfully breed rats for only one snake?

I have TONS of F/T mice for my other two BPs so I can't breed for all three.

Does anyone think it's worth it to start breeding rats for my one female pastel who is only 250grams??

[Gloryhound]

I would like to just add a little note to the discoveries we have had.

When we started very early this year (January, 2008) to actually have more than one ball python we were purchasing mid 2007 born snakes most were born in July and August. They came in in the 150 gram to 250 gram range. Right now the largest of the young ones we bought is 1040 grams. The smallest is 601 grams and both are females. (We have also purchased older girls, but I am leaving them out of the equation at this time.) This summer we bought some babies in June that were only 1 month old, so they were hatched in mid May. They came in 59 grams for the male and 74 grams or so for the female. As of last night before feeding them the male was 551 grams and the Female was 634 grams. In 4 1/2 months they have grown like crazy. We also purchased 2 other females in July that were June born. One of them did not eat for the first month and we had to assist feed to get her started and now she is doing fine. At her lightest she was 35 grams and is now 182 grams. Her sister which ate right away started at 59 grams and is now up to 355 grams. Looking at our records when we get them young (like a month old) their growth rates out do that of the ones that had been previously maintenance fed for the purpose of sale for 6 months before we bought them.

We just got two more new baby het clowns. The female is off to a great start while the male is being little stinker and not eating. We will have to add them to our trends to see how things go. We try getting all of our snakes on rat pups as soon as possible.

This is just some observations we have made that I thought I would put out for those interested, those not interested can take it with a grain of salt.