Sick rats

[syearout]

So I'm trying to get my rat colony off the ground, and I'm doing ok. Built my own rack, which is will post pictures of one of these days. I've got several females that I'm trying to grow out to breeder size. Got a handful of older, bigger girls to breed sooner hopefully. Anyway, tonight I go into the snake room to check on all the snakes, and the rats, refill water, ect.. I notice right off that one rat is getting skinny and kinda sneezing. I pick her up and turn her over, and she is very lethargic. Since all my rats so far have come out of feeder bins, I'm trying to be picky about which one stick around, so she goes in a snake tub. So I go I checking the others, and i have another one in her box that is thin and slow also, not as bad, but breathing very heavily. I also had one in another box that was like that too, also fed off. Is this just respiratory problems? Should I switch from pine to aspen and see if it fixes it? Any suggestions?

[Argentra]

You're using pine? Hmm, not good. Not as bad as cedar of course, but still not good unless it's kiln dried. Hmm, I'm not a ratty expert by any stretch, but I know that listless rats aren't good. Try switching to aspen or woody pet and see what the rat breeders here have to say.

[Patrick Long]

your feeding the sick rats to your snakes.....ew i dont know about that.

[Figure8]

your feeding the sick rats to your snakes.....ew i dont know about that.

As I understand it, rodent diseases cannot be passed on to snakes although I wouldn't make a habit out of it if the sick feeders are on the skinny side.

[NightLad]

As I understand it, rodent diseases cannot be passed on to snakes although I wouldn't make a habit out of it if the sick feeders are on the skinny side.

For the sake of saving $1, I'd not take the chance. We are what we eat. I'm not criticizing anybody, I'm only stating my opinion in how I would handle a similar situation.

As for what's causing the rats to be ill, here is an extensive care sheet on keeping rats - note the Health section and the descriptions of various illnesses: http://www.petratscanada.com/ratcare.htm

I hope this helps.

[lord jackel]

So I'm trying to get my rat colony off the ground, and I'm doing ok. Built my own rack, which is will post pictures of one of these days. I've got several females that I'm trying to grow out to breeder size. Got a handful of older, bigger girls to breed sooner hopefully. Anyway, tonight I go into the snake room to check on all the snakes, and the rats, refill water, ect.. I notice right off that one rat is getting skinny and kinda sneezing. I pick her up and turn her over, and she is very lethargic. Since all my rats so far have come out of feeder bins, I'm trying to be picky about which one stick around, so she goes in a snake tub. So I go I checking the others, and i have another one in her box that is thin and slow also, not as bad, but breathing very heavily. I also had one in another box that was like that too, also fed off. Is this just respiratory problems? Should I switch from pine to aspen and see if it fixes it? Any suggestions?

Just some random thoughts...

were they getting water? You said you went to refill it (auto water or bottle?) how long had it been empty? Rats can go downhill very very quickly without water.

You said they were from the feeder bin...how long have you had them? Did you get them all at the same time? If not you could have brought a bug into the colony (did you quarantine them first?)

What are you feeding them? Junk in = junk out

What is the temp in the rat area? Very cold temps will cause symptoms like you describe.

Instead of feeding them off you might consider taking one to the vet and see what is wrong...if something contagious you will just end up feeding all of them off...when a simple antibiotic might save them.

Hope this helps

[frankykeno]

All I can tell you is back when I was first breeding rats I often picked from a feeder bin at a pet store and often saw health problems. These rats are often overcrowded, fighting for access to food and water and come sometimes from sketchy suppliers in the first place.

Better to either buy from a home breeder or even from a good pet store from their pet rat selection. Give the rats a total going over....look for good body weight, good skin and hair condition, dry and clean ears, butts and noses...no red discharge from nose or eyes....no sores on their tail or bottom of their feet....that sort of stuff. Buy young just recently weaned rats, keep them right and they generally will do very well for you.

I agree with Sean that you may want to figure out what's spreading through your colony before you have a whole pile of dead or dying rats. It sounds like they weren't in great condition in the first place and likely have just gotten worse. Double check your own care of them to make sure you are providing good housing, food and water. Rats are very resiliant creatures but can't produce top feeders under the wrong conditions.

[littleindiangirl]

Was she coughing or sounded congested? I say start adding table scraps, get rid of the pine and use some aspen or pellets. I dont see anything wrong with feeding off sick rats, but not when your ignoring the main problem, It could be a husbandry issue making the myco flare up. I actually dont use any aspen or pellets when I have sick rats. I get them cellsorb (yesterday news) as its nearly dustless and wont aggrivate their sinuses as much as wood product.
You may want to start calling Vets in your area. I called 6 vets before I was recommended to a "small animal/ exotic" breeder that's about 20 minutes away. She's treated rats before and knows what she's doing. The exam was about 35, and the antibiotics I got were another 15$. All in all, my rat is doing great, and hasnt had a flare up since I've been keeping him on cell sorb.

[syearout]

These area all very good points. When I say refilling, I'm referring to refilling bottles. I do it usually once a day so that they never get empty. I am keeping them on pine, so I'll probably try switching to aspen. The rats that I got are from the local pet store that I have posted about in other threads. It is owned and operated my a close friend of mine who breeds his own snakes, and has worked for a commercial rat breeder in the past. He has helped me kinda sift through and pick some of the healthier looking, young rats when they come in from his suppliers. He also knows his suppliers very well, so he can tell he these aren't worth trying to keep, or these should be ok. I have a rack setup, and rats coming in go in there own tub as a group, and don't get mixed. Granted it isn't the best quarantine process, but it isn't throwing them all together either. That is definitely something that I need to look at as well. Thank you all so much for your replies. I may take this last one that is showing signs of illness somewhere to get her checked out.

p.s. The snakes that ate the sick rats are ones that I've never had turn down a meal. they eat every week and still come out of the box like they're hungry. I've seen one eat three rats in one setting. Though that was only once, and is not my common practice. So she does get a full healthy rat every week just like the rest.

[syearout]

Oh, and feeding a medium grade dog food. Diamond Maintainence. With the added scraps of this and that, cereals, pastas, even cooked egg a couple times.

And the temps are the same temp as we keep in the rest of the house. Usually mid 70s.

thanks
again