Is it ok if my bp eats a live mouse, live?

[rabernet]

Here's another link that Joanna shared with me about constriction now being believed to stop the heart rather than suffocating the prey:


http://blogs.nationalgeographic.com/channel/blog/2006/01/explorer_supersnake.html

[littleindiangirl]

Great link!

[Holbeird]

Great Post Robin and Becky.


I agree Becky that I believe most do not stun their prey efficiently and if done incorrectly can cause more harm than good. I'm in no way stating that everyone should stun their mice. I feed most of my snakes live and I have no desire to stun them. I believe the snake can do it's job better then I could ever dream to.

That's a great post about them not suffocating but going into cardiac arrest Robin. Either way though, I wouldn't want to go out that way either! Part of the reason my wife wants me to stop eating so much fatty fried foods, and putting salt on everything! I'd much rather be put into a co2 chamber lol.

Little Indian girl, I agree that you do have some people who are going to be stupid, and put the rat in a bag and smash it against the wall. But when I spoke of stunning I was speaking of a more efficient and less barbaric (in my opinion) way of doing so. Also, I believe that Mice and Rats have an instinctual fear of snakes. Although I have some great eaters in my colony, some that strike before the rat or mouse even hits the floor at times. I have Others who will let the food walk around for 5 or 10 minutes. I've also noticed on occasion (although it's always been mice that have done it) running frantically and jumping towards the top of the tubs trying to get away. I have also noticed one run up and sniff the snake (before I snapped my tongs together to scare it away!) So obviously it's not instinctual to all mice, but some do have that fear. Either way, great post!

[WingedWolfPsion]

My guess is that the animal dies due to a combination of factors when it's being constricted, but certainly I've noticed that prey animals that are proportionately larger (in comparison with the snake) will take longer to die. So, I'm still going with 'baby ball pythons may suffocate their prey'.
I've seen a mouse still periodically struggling a full minute after it was grabbed (and not reflexive twitching, that came later).
There's also rather gruesome footage on youtube of a corn snake swallowing a mouse without bothering to kill it first, so a number of scenarios are possible.
As I said, you can tell what's going on by simply observing the process. It's not that difficult to determine whether or not the rodent is still conscious.
But this isn't really about that, so....

I second the observation that rodents do not recognize the snake as a predator. However, if the snake happens to strike and miss, that changes immediately, and then the rat/mouse can become very disturbed. Some seem only temporarily startled, while others show increasing signs of agitation and fear at that point.

My method of stunning involves smacking the animal over the head. I prefer that to simply putting it in a bag or swinging it by the tail--the rodent doesn't have to experience the sensation of being violently swung around first, and the strike is much more precise, so there's less risk of breaking bones but leaving the animal conscious.

I also aim to hit it hard enough that it will never wake up--if not eaten, then it will slip into death, rather than waking. (Then it goes into the freezer for another try further down the road).

But stunning isn't done for the rodent--it's done to help protect the snake from a bite, and to help the snake get used to taking prey that isn't fleeing or moving violently. It's the snake's well-being that I'm concerned with first. If you want to help the rodent, then pre-kill it.

Either way, it's a difficult act to perform, but we're used to buying our food from supermarkets rather than having to dispatch and clean it ourselves, so must of us just aren't accustomed to it. I think it's more respectful to the animal to do it yourself, rather than leave it for others to do.

[littleindiangirl]

Honestly, I wouldn't didnt know there was a "less barbaric way to stun". Please, how is that done?

[SatanicIntention]

Give the mouse a few shots of Cuervo before you toss him into the tub? That'll leave him stunned for at least a few minutes, haha.

[littleindiangirl]

Give the mouse a few shots of Cuervo before you toss him into the tub? That'll leave him stunned for at least a few minutes, haha.

Yea but when I do that, they just turn into an angry drunk.

[Holbeird]

But then would your snake slither around, knock over it's hides and water bowls before passing out on it's side?

[SatanicIntention]

No, he would cause a scene in the middle of his tub, something about a sexy set of spurs or something, and all of the other snakes would give him dirty looks.

You know snakes.. always causing problems.

[littleindiangirl]

I generally offer stunned prey if a snake refuses pre-killed, and I'm trying to convert it over to f/t eventually. It tends to 'bridge the gap'.

Okay, I can actually agree with this. But then, how is stunned different from pre-killed? Do snakes actually refuse a prekilled over a stunned? They aren't moving except for the breathing, so what stimulation is there to get the snake to strike? Unless its the zombie rat dance