I think my snake loves me

[Jenn]

Not too long ago, people thought that air was simply the absence of everything else. That it didn't have mass and was not tangable, and therefore could not be manipuliated to our advantage. Along comes Bernoulli. And, of course, now we all know that air is tangable and indeed does have mass. As soon as we understood this we were able to fly!!!

Then everyone thought that sound was intangable (again because we couldn't see or touch it) and therefore we could not use IT to our advantage. Enter Marconi, and now we can all watch tv and talk on our cell phones to each other.

The next frontier seems to be THOUGHT. Most people today believe that thought is not tangable. That it exist only in our heads. Many people reason that we can't see it or touch it, therefore we can't use IT to our advantage. Well I don't put myself in the same catagory as Bernoulli and Marconi, but there is no doubt in my mind that thought is in fact a tangable thing. It does have mass and transcends time and space. As soon as we have a thought it exists everywhere all at once. The possibilities are endless once we begin to accept this.

To prove this concept to myself I decided to materilize a dozen yellow roses using nothing but my thoughts. I placed pictures of yellow roses on my refrigerator, my bathroom miror and my pillow. I thought about yellow roses all the time especially every evening and every morning. I used all of my senses. In my mind, I tasted the rosed, I hurt myself on the thorns. I imagined that my pillow was stuffed with rose pedals. And I didn't tell a soul what I was doing. After about two weeks of this, I was at work one day when a white van pulled in the driveway. I began to tremble. I knew what was about to happen and suddenly I didn't want it to be true. But it was. The driver handed me a dozen yellow roses!!! They were from an aquaintance in Germany!!!! I called to thank her and she told me the story of how about "two weeks ago" she had started smelling flowers all the time. And how thoughts of flowers came to her throughout the day. And how finally one day she couldn't stand it any longer, and passing by a flower shop decided to stop in. She told me that she decided on the spot to buy herself a dozen roses but began to feel selfish and changed her mind. She would send the flowers to a friend instead. She choose me, and at the last minute she asked the clerk to change the order from red roses to yellow roses.

My point is this... every creature has a thought process, and every though is projected into the universe. People tend to think that we are somehow better than all other creatures. We tend to personify everything, especially our pets. But we also tend to forget that we ourselves came from lower life forms!!!! Every life form has the ability to evolve into any other life form. It happens all the time but so slowly that we tend to deny it because we cannot see it happen. Our own evoloution to a higher life form is what has enabled us to have these emotions we love to talk about so much. There was a time in our past when we were not capable of love just the same way you believe your snake is not capable of these higher emotions. Hello folks... we WERE the snakes!!!!

So I will remain open-minded that all living creatures are capable of evolving into higher life forms just as we did, and therefore carry the capacity for love always. Just because we are at the top of the food chain right now does not mean that we will always be. A million years from now snakes may sit around wondering if humans are capable of love.

[MelissaFlipski]

Pretty cool post, Jenn. But it may be too "out there" for some people's taste.

I leave it at - we don't really know, do we?

I see evidence of an ever growing bond with the sweet BP we've had for only a few months. I wonder how amazing that will be in 5, 10, 15 years. He seems to really enjoy being a household pet. He seems to recognize who who knows and doesn't know and shows preferences for the familiar over the strange, for the gentle and loving over the wilder handlers.

[ksbrneyes30]

How do you know snakes can't love or hate? Have you ever been given the super human talent of feeling what other creatures experience?

I believe they do "feel" ... hell, i have one bp that's ticked off all the time and hisses any time i stick my hand in the tank and who strikes the glass when i walk by and another who while very young, escaped his tank (my own fault) and after hours of looking everywhere, i flop on my bed to cry and feel something under my pillow, turns out my escape artist turned up in my pillow case ... not my husbands, or in a nice warm spot.

He knows I'm the one who rubs my nails gently down his back - he arches himself so that i don't lose contact all the way to the tail. I drop the mice in his tank. I made him feel better when he had mites.

Maybe a snake loves (respects, admires, is thankful for) their owner if they are treated right (and I choose to believe this), but any creature who is cared for by another recgonizes the caretaker and will usually respond with an affectionate demeanor.

Cobra's will spit aiming at the eyes of what it feels to be it's enemy (it's a snake, how does it know to spit towards the eyes? It's not human but knows what to do to us to disable us quickly).

If a snake can instinctively know how to harm us, don't you think that if we respect them for what they are and provide them with all their necessities they just might develop a respect (or dare i say a love) for us?

[MeMe]

How do you know snakes can't love or hate? Have you ever been given the super human talent of feeling what other creatures experience?

I do have super human talents but that is neither here nor there.

escaped his tank (my own fault) and after hours of looking everywhere, i flop on my bed to cry and feel something under my pillow, turns out my escape artist turned up in my pillow case ... not my husbands, or in a nice warm spot.

Of course it was YOUR fault.

So your saying that you didn't secure one of your enclosures and your snake got out....slithered his lil self all over sniffing your pillow out cause...He loves you...

I don't buy it.

I made him feel better when he had mites.

How did he get mites?

Maybe a snake loves (respects, admires, is thankful for) their owner if they are treated right (and I choose to believe this), but any creature who is cared for by another recgonizes the caretaker and will usually respond with an affectionate demeanor.

What are you referring to...dogs, cats, domesticated animals???

You are probably right...your snake just wants to be hugged and kissed...

I tell you what...If your snake 'knows' you so well and LOVES you soooo much...Hold a rat on feeding day and then put just your hand in the tub and tell me if he strikes you. I mean...if he loves you why would he strike you???

Cobra's will spit aiming at the eyes of what it feels to be it's enemy (it's a snake, how does it know to spit towards the eyes? It's not human but knows what to do to us to disable us quickly).

uhmmm I don't know anything about cobras but I would have to say....that is their defense mechanism...which they do to all other species also.

If a snake can instinctively know how to harm us, don't you think that if we respect them for what they are and provide them with all their necessities they just might develop a respect (or dare i say a love) for us?

Sure...cause snakes are just that complex.

[darkangel]

DUDE BURN.

ksbrneyes30, how can you even presume to oversimply their behavior like that? Do you really think your snake PURPOSELY went to your pillow because he adores you???? God I really hope that is not your line of thinking.

[Freakie_frog]

How do you know snakes can't love or hate? Have you ever been given the super human talent of feeling what other creatures experience?

No I haven't. But as humans we like to think that emotion is a trait solely possessed by humans. Is it possible that animals can feel emotion...maybe..but to take a firm stand that "YES THEY CAN" with no more proof than we can offer to disprove the fact is just as naive.

I believe they do "feel" ... hell, i have one bp that's ticked off all the time and hisses any time i stick my hand in the tank and who strikes the glass when i walk by

This sounds like a fear response not an anger management problem. See because we as larger creatures with round pupil forward set eyes are seen in the animal kingdom as a predator. This sounds like when you walk by the cage or stick your hand into it your snake feels like your going to try and eat it. So it tries to keep you from it. Even a long time pet snake with snap into defensive mode if surprised or startled.

and another who while very young, escaped his tank (my own fault) and after hours of looking everywhere, i flop on my bed to cry and feel something under my pillow, turns out my escape artist turned up in my pillow case ... not my husbands, or in a nice warm spot.

As heart warming a thought as this is you must remember your snake had also been dozens of other places before that and had it not been found would have been many more places after the pillow case.

He knows I'm the one who rubs my nails gently down his back - he arches himself so that i don't lose contact all the way to the tail. I drop the mice in his tank. I made him feel better when he had mites.

Please try something for me get your husband to try this with a wooden spoon or just his hand and see if you don't get the same response. Again this is a typical response that I get from snakes I have had for years and snakes I don't even own.

Maybe a snake loves (respects, admires, is thankful for) their owner if they are treated right (and I choose to believe this),

I am glad that you feel so strongly about your pets it is a great thing to be an animal lover and even more so because they are herps. I just hate to think that you have false expectations about what your snake gets out of being your pet.

but any creature who is cared for by another recognizes the caretaker and will usually respond with an affectionate demeanor.

And yet you have one that hisses and strikes and wont even let you in it's tank. So is that because of the caretaker or because the animal is afraid?
Lions that are well cared for and loved by the people that care for them killer their keepers, The family dog will bite if scared or injured even if the person is acting in its best interest.
In the end snakes are wild animals could they survive in the wild maybe but that doesn't make them any less wild.

Cobra's will spit aiming at the eyes of what it feels to be it's enemy (it's a snake, how does it know to spit towards the eyes? It's not human but knows what to do to us to disable us quickly).

If a snake can instinctively know how to harm us, don't you think that if we respect them for what they are and provide them with all their necessities they just might develop a respect (or dare i say a love) for us?

Spitting cobras spit for the same reason balls ball up its how they have over years learned to best protect themselves.

Do i feel that reptiles can learn to understand we aren't going to hurt them, in a word show them that we aren't a predator. The answer is a resounding YES!!!!!

Do I feel they can experiance love as we do or on any level no. As much as I would like to have snakes that missed me when I am gone and cried when I came home from a long trip, its just not how the animal is designed.

Just my two cents

[Morphie]

I don't really care to argue whether snakes are capable of emotion and/or to what level, because it's all speculative. I do know humans are capable of emotion, however, and that the way some of you treat each other is downright unnecessary and appallingly unkind. I saw a lot of it in this thread and it upset me a lot.

There is no reason to be cutting. It doesn't promote your point of view... at all. If anything, it turns people off to it and makes them write you off as conversationally not worth while. I see it all over this forum. I hear people complain about it all the time. I think this is the kind of thing Brian was talking about the other day on Reptile Radio, and it sucks.

[MelissaFlipski]

I don't really care to argue whether snakes are capable of emotion and/or to what level, because it's all speculative. I do know humans are capable of emotion, however, and that the way some of you treat each other is downright unnecessary and appallingly unkind. I saw a lot of it in this thread and it upset me a lot.

There is no reason to be cutting. It doesn't promote your point of view... at all. If anything, it turns people off to it and makes them write you off as conversationally not worth while. I see it all over this forum. I hear people complain about it all the time. I think this is the kind of thing Brian was talking about the other day on Reptile Radio, and it sucks.

Yikes. I was wondering about that myself (on Reptile Radio). And I see the brutality, too, though when I mention it might be aimed at me, I am labeled defensive, etc.

Anyway, there are a lot of good people and good posts, and no matter how much I personally get bashed (ooops, being defensive again there), I still love it here. I'm learning about grains of salt.

[JLC]

I don't really care to argue whether snakes are capable of emotion and/or to what level, because it's all speculative. I do know humans are capable of emotion, however, and that the way some of you treat each other is downright unnecessary and appallingly unkind. I saw a lot of it in this thread and it upset me a lot.

There is no reason to be cutting. It doesn't promote your point of view... at all. If anything, it turns people off to it and makes them write you off as conversationally not worth while. I see it all over this forum. I hear people complain about it all the time. I think this is the kind of thing Brian was talking about the other day on Reptile Radio, and it sucks.

Unfortunately, this is true of all Internet forums. And really, any human society. It's just that on the Internet, people feel more free to be snotty to each other than they would face-to-face. But they're still just as snotty in their hearts in real life, if they behave that way in the semi-anonymous venue of a forum.

The problem is, we can't legislate "nice". We can't make rules that force people to be kind and generous and patient and understanding. We can't control the fact that some people are just naturally abrassive, even if they are kind hearted. And we can't control the fact that some people behave rudely just to entertain themselves and see how much drama they can start without actually breaking any rules.

The best we can do is set a good example and use community "peer pressure" to help people learn to get along with each other. And I'd say that BP.net does a much better job of it than 95% of all other forums of similar size and nature.

If someone feels that this sort of thing is becoming a problem...the very best thing to do is set the example by being kind and patient to everyone, even those who annoy you. Complaining about it openly only makes things worse by making it appear to be a far more prevelant problem than it really is. Although I'll say this...one benefit to a public complaint is it gives me a chance to step in and remind everyone to try a little harder to be nice and remember that people aren't going to come and learn how to do better if we make them feel stupid or drive them away with sarcasm or elitist attitudes.

[cheryls]

I'm pretty convinced that our snake knows who I am and correlates my smell with care and recognizes the vibration of my voice when I come in his room at night and talk to him.

If humans have human emotions, isn't is possible that snakes have snake emotions? That when temps and humidity are right - when they're healthy and well fed - aren't they generally calmer and therefore happier in snake terms?

If they had nothing, their behaviors wouldn't change when uncomfortable or not well cared for. Behavior and feelings and/or emotion go hand in hand, I believe, in all living creatures.

It might not be love as we know it - but there's definitely something there otherwise how would we know when we're doing the right thing?