Questions for the General Public

[Melicious]

So...my job, in your eyes, as a teacher, is to regurgitate what the book says and not encourage independent thought. Am I right?

[Jeanne]

I see it as a religious text book to be taken with a grain of salt as I do text books in science class. ^_^

If it is school text books you take with a grain of salt as you do the bible..then maybe you should reconsider going into the education career at all, because bottom line, school text books are what you will be teaching from. How and why would you even attempt to teach something you take with a grain of salt?

Medusa probably hit closest to home. I don't envision myself standing at my "pulpit" with my hands raised high screaming at my students, "Come to God, children! This mockery of Christ will send you to hell!" I simply want to encourage their own research. Whether they agree with/disagree with/aren't sure about, evolution is their own deal. I would like them to understand that it's okay to look at other options, further understand evolution, and if they stumble upon a creationist story and that fits dearer to their heart, then so be it.

Letting students learn that there are other ideas out there is ok, however, giving them any type of religious "training/learning" is still wrong. You would do well to remember to keep religion out of science. There are always gonna be ppl out there and students who dont want religious instruction, and even hinting on the "other" religious stuff will cause a stir b/c there is always gonna be someone who feels you are infringing on thier rights/beliefs...

[Colin Vestrand]

here's how i look at it (coming from a future bio/chem teacher)...
you teach whats in your curriculum. personally i think evolution is full of holes so i plan on giving 'disclaimer' that it truly is the 'theory' of evolution. i don't think anyone can deny that we're all changing, evolving, adapting, whatever you want to call it... it's the beginnings that just dont add up.
that said, evolution is very important to learn in terms of general biology!

[Jeanne]

And Jeanne, you're one of those parents that would probably have me hung. ^_^ Not because I was bashing Bible or Quran, or any other religious text down your child's throat, but because I would encourage your child to look behind the text book and look at other options.

You are right on your assessment there, only because it is not your business nor your responsibility or any other teacher/offical in a school to teach my children or other ppls children about religion. Doing so over steps your boundry lines as an educator... it has nothing to do with "encouraging my child to look behind the text book and look at other options", encouraging children to do so is good in many ways, I do so here at home... however, it also hinges on the subject of the matter. If the subject is one such as religion being taught in a school, your right, I am gonna have a fit, right along with my 14 year old daughter and wait for the district to bar-b-que your contract in favor of a teacher who will stick to the text book.

[Jeanne]

So...my job, in your eyes, as a teacher, is to regurgitate what the book says and not encourage independent thought. Am I right?

Your job as a teacher/educator, is to do nothing but teach whats in the text book, in whatever way neccessary to get the kids attention and willingness to learn (that in itself is hard, try it first before you try teaching religious stuff)..... it has been done this way for a long time.... go ahead and encourage independant thought, however, do not teach religious propaganda.

[Melicious]

I see it as a religious text book to be taken with a grain of salt as I do text books in science class. ^_^

If it is school text books you take with a grain of salt as you do the bible..then maybe you should reconsider going into the education career at all, because bottom line, school text books are what you will be teaching from. How and why would you even attempt to teach something you take with a grain of salt?

Medusa probably hit closest to home. I don't envision myself standing at my "pulpit" with my hands raised high screaming at my students, "Come to God, children! This mockery of Christ will send you to hell!" I simply want to encourage their own research. Whether they agree with/disagree with/aren't sure about, evolution is their own deal. I would like them to understand that it's okay to look at other options, further understand evolution, and if they stumble upon a creationist story and that fits dearer to their heart, then so be it.

Letting students learn that there are other ideas out there is ok, however, giving them any type of religious "training/learning" is still wrong. You would do well to remember to keep religion out of science. There are always gonna be ppl out there and students who dont want religious instruction, and even hinting on the "other" religious stuff will cause a stir b/c there is always gonna be someone who feels you are infrining on thier rights/beliefs...

That's basically what I just stated. I don't want to sit at my pulpit and preach about God. I spent far too much dealing with that from my own father to want to do that to anyone else. (Yeah...at about fifteen, because I was dabbling into Wicca/Paganesque religions, I was told I was going to burn in hell. Fun stuff)! I don't want to persecute anyone for their religion. I simply want to encourage my students to learn about their world. To learn how to better research. If that's a crime, I ought not to be a teacher. I was under the impression that school was for learning, expanding your skills in research, and becoming your own person with the aid/help/encouragement of people like me who want to teach.

Oh, and on a side note, I don't even know if evolution will even a part of the cirriculum.

[Mendel's Balls]

Medusa probably hit closest to home. I don't envision myself standing at my "pulpit" with my hands raised high screaming at my students, "Come to God, children! This mockery of Christ will send you to hell!" I simply want to encourage their own research. Whether they agree with/disagree with/aren't sure about, evolution is their own deal. I would like them to understand that it's okay to look at other options, further understand evolution, and if they stumble upon a creationist story and that fits dearer to their heart, then so be it.

I just find that if I encourage them to look at other options, not necessarily point them in the right direction, they might learn a little better. I can, however; envision myself standing in front of my class(not behind a podium), and stating very simply: Evolution is the accepted norm for our coming into exist, however; evolution isn't completely tried and true, and I encourage you to look at other scientific and otherwise "theories." (Oh, and yes, I love my quote hand movements)! I encourage you all to look through LexusNexus, science journals; scholarly sources are your best bet. Oh, and Matt, you can take Ody out. (Oh yes! I will have snakes in my classroom).

So...I don't want to teach them religion. I don't want to teach them to be religious. I don't even want to mention the word God. I simply want to let them know that there are other options out there, whether scientific or otherwise. ^_^ I want to encourage that they learn outside of the classroom. That's all. Whether it's evolution or the stem cell research going on.

I agree with Jeanne with one minor disagreement........YOu don’t need to teach TO the science textbook....in fact, in my opinion, most good science teachers do bring in labs, activities, experiences, that extend beyond the textbook. However, these inquiry activities most often build upon the themes discussed in the textbook......

And these activities must (by law) follow the guidelines of the state standards.......ideally, they follow the vision of science education set forth by National Science Education Standards (NSES) and the AAAS' Benchmarks for Scientific Inquiry.

In general, there are three lofty goals to science ed.

1. The development of intellectual skills (critical thinking, problem solving, etc.)
2. The understanding and appreciation of the methods and nature of science
3. The mastery of science facts, concepts, and principles.

You may think that the "research" you seem to want to encourage them to do falls within the first realm.....However, this reseach you wish to promote to students certainly conflicts the second and third goals!

You want to teach them research using the methods of science (in fact you must these are in most state standards....and textbooks wont help with this very much).....

You want to teach them how to research using the sources of science......

I encourage some use of Science Journals (however, for the most part they are just not developmentally appropriate for the high school level).....

but what (legitimate) science journal can you find that doesn’t support the idea that evolution is a fact and that NeoDarwinism is the main and currently most accepted mechanism of evolution?

Furthermore, What science magazine fall within this realm? None also.....Promoting the use of sources Scientific American, Popular Science, Discover,or even a godo newspaper for a current events or current research assignment is a great idea......but what sources did you have mind?

Science is a specific way of knowing and that's what you need to impart to you students as a professional science educator. Again....I am unsure if you really understand what science is or what the goals of science education are.....if you do really understand these then your just ignoring them and trying to promote your own agenda.

The NSES are online.....check out them out here http://newton.nap.edu/html/nses/

Chapter 6 is the standards regarding what you teach to students......they provide a large framework to explore many, many types of scientific phenomena...more than you could ever want to cover well in a school year! If they don’t fall somehow within these guidelines chances are honey they don’t fall within the realm of science! And hence you have no business going there!

Maybe you know science or know how to do science better than the National Academy of Sciences or American Association for the Advancement of Sciences (AAAS)......Now to me, that kind of view is elitist!

[Melicious]

I can't teach precisely to the text book. I was subjugated to that throughout high school and I learned very little. If taught in an interesting way, with encouragement, however; I learned quickly and excelled.

I think the problem with a lot of teachers today is that's all they do: Teach to the textbook without making the material come alive and mean something.

[Mendel's Balls]

here's how i look at it (coming from a future bio/chem teacher)...
you teach whats in your curriculum. personally i think evolution is full of holes so i plan on giving 'disclaimer' that it truly is the 'theory' of evolution. i don't think anyone can deny that we're all changing, evolving, adapting, whatever you want to call it... it's the beginnings that just dont add up.
that said, evolution is very important to learn in terms of general biology!

Darwinism and the facts that support evolution say nothing about the origin or beginning of life.......

The origin of life is under scientific study....but it is a very specific branch of scientific study....and this is not in state or national standards to my knowledge!

[Mendel's Balls]

I can't teach precisely to the text book. I was subjugated to that throughout high school and I learned very little. If taught in an interesting way, with encouragement, however; I learned quickly and excelled.

I think the problem with a lot of teachers today is that's all they do: Teach to the textbook without making the material come alive and mean something.

You missed my point......to state it in a phrase...your job as a science teacher is to make science come alive!