variations

[blackula19]

do each of the variations that i often hear referenced, like granite, blushing (btw what is the actual definition of blushing b/c i can't seem to get a good hold on it from pics), clear belly, jungle, partial stripe, rings, blackback, etc....correspond to producing different traits or morphs when bred? i know about the het pied marker and what its supposed to be, are these other traits believed to have similar implications or are they just oddities, so they may be more likely to produce further odditites? or are they jut different traits that people enjoy in and of themselves.... i'm really curious about the significance of these traits and any opinion or input would really be appreciated. thanks. ed

[jglass38]

Blackback and granite are proven traits. Jungle is an unproven trait. The others may or may not mean anything. I am sure others will have more info for you.

[blackula19]

when you say proven, you mean that they are genetically inherited, right? so are there further genetic implications, like is there any reason to beleive that these traits are on the same chromosome as other traits or morphs (please bear with me i am pretty new to ball pythons and haven't been in a genetics class in years)? i think i heard something about how granites are a key ingredient to some codominant morph or unlocking something bizarre (i know that's pretty vague, but i don't remember where i read it)....like do these variations have those kind of implications as far as anyone knows? i know that there are tons of normals snakes with the pied marker, but from what i've heard from some breeders there is something to it.....you know what i'm getting at.....

[Adam_Wysocki]

you know what i'm getting at

Not really?

-adam

[blackula19]

basically, i'm curious if any of those other traits are potentially some kind of marker also, like has anyone ever gotten that impression through their breeding experience....i'm new to ball pythons, but i know that a lot of serious breeders and hobbyists breed them en mass and i was wondering if anyone has observed any of these traits having greater implications or if these traits are the only end results that can be expected

[Adam_Wysocki]

basically, i'm curious if any of those other traits are potentially some kind of marker also

Also?

There are no proven "markers" in ball pythons ... it's all speculation and it's not very consistent. Even the worlds top three producers of pieds can't agree on what the so-called "het pied marker" actually is.

-adam

[jglass38]

basically, i'm curious if any of those other traits are potentially some kind of marker also, like has anyone ever gotten that impression through their breeding experience....i'm new to ball pythons, but i know that a lot of serious breeders and hobbyists breed them en mass and i was wondering if anyone has observed any of these traits having greater implications or if these traits are the only end results that can be expected

All of what you mentioned except the ones I mentioned were proven traits are just unproven. Nobody has been able to prove them as anything more than abberancies. Adam explained the markers debate (or whatever you would call it)

[blackula19]

who are the top three producer that don't agree and is there anyplace i can read their opinions? i can't seem to find anything like that on the net....even if nothing is proven, just reading the theories would satisfy my curiousity....or if there are no links or anything what do they say the markers are? since it is such a debatable topic even to be able to compare some theories would be great. thanks. ed

[jglass38]

Ya got me. I can't seem to find any articles. Pete Kahl is one...The other 2? Could be the Barkers and RDR?

Did I come close Adam?

[blackula19]

what about bob clark? would he be in that mix? also what company are the barkers, i'm not familiar with them.