Clutches identification

[mm08]

Hello!
Can I ask you for help with identification of two clutches.

First one should be from Firefly Piebald (male) x Pastel Super Vanilla (female), but I think the female could have different genes. Some of babies looks like have Disco gene.

In my opinion I have:
1. Normal het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

2. Super Pastel Vanilla Fire het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

3. Pastel Disco Inferno het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

4. Disco Inferno het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

5. Super Pastel het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

6. Pastel Disco/Vanilla het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

7. Disco Inferno het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

8. Pastel Vanilla Fire het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

9. Pastel het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694


Second clutch is from Super Banana Black Pastel Fire Piebald poss. Yellow Belly (male) x Normal (female).

I think I have:
1. Banana Fire het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

2. Banana het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

3. Banana Fire het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

4. Banana Fire het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

5. Banana Fire het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

6. Banana het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

7. Banana het Pied
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

[KingPythons]

They’re someone on here that works with fire stuff. I’m sure he will get a look at this. You got some real awesome looking babies. That one labeled disco het pied look like it’s already in pied form. Stunning truly stunning.

[MissingLink]

Disco and vanilla are almost identical and nearly impossible to tell apart aside from certain combos. So the ones you have labeled disco are vanilla. Disco inferno would look a lot like vanilla and fire

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

[nikkubus]

Aside from Disco/Vanilla thing plus every single one should have Vanilla, I agree with clutch 1. 1,5,9 have Vanilla on top of what you listed, and I can see it, not just going by what it has to be with Super mom. The blushing is heavier, and the color is different from regular pastel/super pastel.

Clutch 2 you are definitely missing some things.
Pic of sire would really help here. 1,4,6 seem like they have Black Pastel to me with the amount of side pattern reduction. The amount of white in the alienheads looks stronger than I've seen Fire and YB cause, even with het Pied, so maybe there is something else? Any idea what else might be in Sire based on his parents? Pic of dam might help too, maybe there is something subtle in her being missed.

[mm08]

Here are parent's photos of both clutches:

First one:

male:
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

female (female is in shed):
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

Second one:

male:
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

Here photo when he was younger:
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...3&userid=90694

female:
https://ball-pythons.net/gallery/sho...mageuser=90694

I would like to confirm if I understood you properly. Do you think there is no Disco gene in this clutch, just Vanilla right?

In the second clutch, I have had the same doubts about babies pattern, but I have no idea what extra gene they could have.

[nikkubus]

(clutch 1) I think it's more likely she is Super Vanilla than Disco Vanilla. Either one is possible, but it's so hard to tell apart that I would go off what she is labeled. Either way, they all have one or the other since Disco and Vanilla are allelic. Sire's Fire would always be in addition to one of those in the ~%50 that would get it even though Fire is also allelic.

(clutch 2) Shoot, sire is really high white so I can't see a whole lot from him. Dam has a pretty black dorsal and some odd white speckles, so maybe that explains some of what's going on. She may not have a "morph" as much as just some polygenic pattern traits coming out. 3,7 have the strongest Fire markers that I can see. Maybe somebody who has specifically worked with Banana Pied can drop a light on what's going on better. I have worked with both, but not in the same project. The colors in some of them are so vivid orange that I think it has to be YB, but photos can really be deceiving sometimes.