Is This Scale Rot?

[camilleon]

A couple of weeks ago I noticed scratches on my ball pythons belly, they were brown in color, and seemed to be abrasions from his substrate of cypress mulch. However at the time I didn't believe them to be anything of major concern, and just checked over his cage for anything sharp. Today as I was taking him out I noticed the scratches were in much more abundance than they had been previously, and accompanied by pink patches on his scales that were different textures. I became worried and found several small spots of reddish brown and realized that many of his belly scales were chipped, and now I'm worried he may have scale rot.

Originally I thought it was burns, but after checking all the heating elements in his tank and looking over the spots that doesn't seem to be the case. From what I can gather they look like scratches from something, and then scale rot has begun setting in.

As we speak I have treated his substrate with anti-mite spray and removed all the things from his enclosure. Nothing seems to be capable of scratching or hurting him, and his substrate has not been overly humid or wet at all. A small urate patch was found hidden behind a stick but other than that there's absolutely no feces or urine for bacteria to cause it either.

I will be taking him to be checked over tomorrow, and hopefully get a diagnosis or cause so I can fix the problem, but does anyone have a clue what this might be caused by? Or what it is? I'm extremely worried about him as it spans the length of his belly.

Thank You!






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[Bogertophis]

I'd personally worry more about the pink belly than the "scratches", which I think are just the normal surface imperfections that are now highlighted because debris (substrate) has become embedded in those tiny crevices. Snakes do nick their scales some when they crawl about- that's why they have scales in the first place- to protect their body. The pink belly can be a normal pre-shed thing, or a burn (!) from UTH, or a serious infection (septicemia), so I'm glad you're getting him checked out & trying to determine what's going on.

More info- how are you heating his enclosure? How are you controlling the heat? How are you making SURE it's the right temperature UNDER THE SUBSTRATE where the snake may go? Is there a "cool side" without heat, & if so, what proportion of the enclosure is unheated?

If you're using UTH- it's very easy for excessive substrate (such as mulch) to become "insulation"- not allowing enough heat to rise THRU it, & instead overheating the temperature of the cage floor. When using UTH, it's essential to measure all surfaces that the snake can touch (assume he's going to burrow under the substrate!) You MUST check temperatures accurately, not take a thermostat's "word for it"- a t-stat tells you what it's set to, but probes can move & otherwise fail. (WHERE IS THE PROBE located?) Honestly, this looks like a burn to me- but that's not a diagnosis.

And "news flash"- there's plenty of bacteria in there even if you don't see fecal matter left behind. I'd suggest keeping him on clean white paper towels as substrate for the time being.

You didn't mention how he's acting? Is he eating? (Septicemia is very serious, but I think your snake would be showing symptoms beyond just the coloration.)

[Malum Argenteum]

As we speak I have treated his substrate with anti-mite spray

Are there snake mites visible?

[camilleon]

The pink belly looks much more pink on camera than it is in person. In person his belly is a pale, almost white pink, however several of his scales seem to have their “surface layer” scratched off and creating a pinker spot. The main reason I ruled out burns is because they’re small and scattered across his belly, instead of one broad or bigger spot that stands out. And they look like abrasions rather than burns. While I won’t say it’s definitely not burns because I can’t say for sure, I am fairly certain that isn’t the case.

The heating setup in his 4x2x2 tank is a 100w heat emitting ceramic bulb alongside a second 60w one to create a hot and cool side. Both are surrounded by cages and are warm, but not hot to the touch as you can hold your hand on them for several minutes. The reason I have two is so I can turn off or on the 60w one as temperatures fluctuate in my room ( It can go from 80 degrees to 69 in my room in the same day ). When my room is its average temp of 75 degrees, his tank will have a warmer side of 88 degrees, and a cooler side of 79. When it’s 80 degrees in my room I have to turn off the 60W bulb as it can get up to the high 90’s. Alongside this there is a heating mat on a quarter of the underside of the enclosure that is regulated using a BN-Link Digital Heat Mat Thermostat, set to 90 degrees Fahrenheit. The probe for it is in a rock hide under a thin layer of substrate that touches the pvc directly on top of the heat mat. And I’ve stuck my hand into the hide and wiggled my finger down the to the pvc to double check that it’s not too hot, and from what I can tell it doesn’t seem to even radiate heat rather than just make the ambient temperature of that hide 90 degrees.

My snake seems to be healthy other than his belly. He is not showing any lethargy and gets very active at night and dismantles all of his decor during this time (to which I have to fix in the morning lol). While I was taking pictures he was very much trying to explore and escape. Although he’s been on a feeding strike since February. Despite my efforts of trying to feed him prekilled rats that are still actively warm, and making the rats seem alive with tweezers and making it move around his tank, he shows little to no interest. I chocked this down to either him reaching sexual maturity because he’s right around that age, or just some periodic fasting. He’s not losing any weight, or showing any signs of illness, and since it’s only a two month fast I believed it to be normal.

I will keep him on paper towels for the time being, however it is notable that the substrate isn’t all that old, having gotten it mid March

Thank you for your help!!

[camilleon]

No, I looked very closely and gently lifted a few of his scales and there are no visible mites or tiny dots that look similar. He has banana spots as he’s a banana BP but I double checked them to ensure they were markings on his scales and not mites

[Malum Argenteum]

No, I looked very closely and gently lifted a few of his scales and there are no visible mites or tiny dots that look similar. He has banana spots as he’s a banana BP but I double checked them to ensure they were markings on his scales and not mites

Then I'd recommend not treating for mites.

It sounds like you're running CHEs without thermostats. If so, it would be much safer to run them with thermostats; every supplemental heat source should be thermostatically controlled, and each should have its own thermostat channel. This comment isn't directly related to your current concerns (as far as I can tell), but is a general comment both for you and for future readers of this thread.

[camilleon]

It was just a precaution because I saw a small black bug crawling on the cork bark. I don’t think it was a mite as it was too big but just in case, but thank you!

[Bogertophis]

the pink belly looks much more pink on camera than it is in person.....
this is why a vet visit is more appropriate than trying to diagnose online-
.....and i’ve stuck my hand into the hide and wiggled my finger down the to the pvc to double check that it’s not too hot, and from what i can tell it doesn’t seem to even radiate heat rather than just make the ambient temperature of that hide 90 degrees....

remember our human body temperature is around 98.6*- too hot for our snakes- and- that's why you cannot assess the safety of temperatures in a snake's home by hand- 90* is roughly their upper limit, but doesn't feel hot to us.

my snake seems to be healthy other than his belly. ......he’s not losing any weight, or showing any signs of illness, and since it’s only a two month fast i believed it to be normal....

great! Feeding pre-killed can be a battle for many bps- but safety is worth it- hang in there.

I will keep him on paper towels for the time being, however it is notable that the substrate isn’t all that old, having gotten it mid march

if you're sure there's no mites & it's not dirty, you can save & re-use substrate when there's no longer a skin issue being treated. Might be a good idea to bake it (very low & slow oven for an hour or so-supervised!) just in case.

thank you for your help!!

you're most welcome-

[Bogertophis]

It was just a precaution because I saw a small black bug crawling on the cork bark. I don’t think it was a mite as it was too big but just in case, but thank you!

The white paper towels will help you assess the possible mite situation- look for tiny specks in the water bowl- they hide very well on a snake's body- especially around the eyes, in nostrils, on the chin, & under scales anywhere, including the "vent". I would avoid treating for mites unless you're sure they exist- and only snake mites really matter. Wood mites sometimes occur (especially with wood & mulch decor) & they're annoying but won't hurt the snake. Sometimes the warmth & humidity attracts other insects too, like fungus gnats. Also, IF you find snake mites, discard ALL decor made of wood as it's porous & both mites & their eggs will be hiding & residing there.

BTW, How long have you had this snake? Is is your only snake? Here's hoping you don't have any snake mites. They are tiny- like a pinpoint- & may appear black, brown or red when they've been sucking blood from your snake. They also move- unlike the specks that "came with your snake"-

[camilleon]

The white paper towels will help you assess the possible mite situation- look for tiny specks in the water bowl- they hide very well on a snake's body- especially around the eyes, in nostrils, on the chin, & under scales anywhere, including the "vent". I would avoid treating for mites unless you're sure they exist- and only snake mites really matter. Wood mites sometimes occur (especially with wood & mulch decor) & they're annoying but won't hurt the snake. Sometimes the warmth & humidity attracts other insects too, like fungus gnats. Also, IF you find snake mites, discard ALL decor made of wood as it's porous & both mites & their eggs will be hiding & residing there.

BTW, How long have you had this snake? Is is your only snake? Here's hoping you don't have any snake mites. They are tiny- like a pinpoint- & may appear black, brown or red when they've been sucking blood from your snake. They also move- unlike the specks that "came with your snake"-

I have been looking vigorously and found no tiny specks, whether in his water dish, his eyes, his vent, etc. The paper towels are also clean.

He is my first and only snake, and I got him July 31st, 2020, so he’s almost three 😊

I just got him checked over by a reptile specialist, and she said it seems like due to the fact that he’s about to shed, and that I have cypress mulch and cork bark, that the scratches are his shed skin first coming off, and then getting filled in and made more visible by the dust of the mulch. And the red scratch on his side is from him rubbing himself too hard on something (most likely the cork bark), and due to him being a banana the scratch is especially visible. She also said to just wait till he sheds fully, and give him a once over again and come back if there’s any remaining marks. Otherwise he is very healthy, which gives me peace of mind.

Thank you for your help again!!