The ethos of breeders

[Adam_Wysocki]

Yes you are right, something to do with illegal turtles.

And it does not affect my opinion on his bp's either,nor his and Robbie's helpful nature... cause I would happily buy from him again.

Jeanne, this isn't to be confrontational ... I'm really just curious ... what level of illegal activity must a person reach to actually affect your opinion on whether or not you'd purchase from him or her?

This really has nothing at all to do with Don but more to do with whom people choose to purchase from .... your post really got me thinking?

Do you feel that as long as the illegal activity isn't directly related to selling animals that the person is still deserving of your business?

Is violating a federal wildlife protection statute not signifigant enough of a crime to avoid a seller all together? .... What if an other wise good seller was charged with selling dime bags to kids? Still has the same great animals and service, but the charge is out there .... would you still purchase animals from that person?

I think that as long as this post isn't taken the wrong way (and I really hope that it's not), it could be an interesting discussion???

-adam

[rex322]

i thought they confiscated his animals though?

[Smulkin]

None of that had yet happened when I made the purchase - I dare say it hadn't happened when Jeanne had either so it could not reflect on their helpfulness or the quality of the animals at that time.

The dime bag to kids is a far far fetched stretch of an analogy.
Would you suggest anyone who has been charged with anything be eternally blacklisted as a seller?

Hello im going to head up to Columbus Ohio and pick me up some stuff at the Reptile expo and was wondering if anyone has orderd off this guy before

was the question - and the responses were valid I think.

[Jeanne]

Jeanne, this isn't to be confrontational ... I'm really just curious ... what level of illegal activity must a person reach to actually affect your opinion on whether or not you'd purchase from him or her?

This really has nothing at all to do with Don but more to do with whom people choose to purchase from .... your post really got me thinking?

Do you feel that as long as the illegal activity isn't directly related to selling animals that the person is still deserving of your business?

I think in this case, Don made a dumb mistake, for whatever reason, but the reason is not important to me, because we are not all perfect and I bet he has learned from this.

Is violating a federal wildlife protection statute not signifigant enough of a crime to avoid a seller all together? .... What if an other wise good seller was charged with selling dime bags to kids? Still has the same great animals and service, but the charge is out there .... would you still purchase animals from that person?

I think that as long as this post isn't taken the wrong way (and I really hope that it's not), it could be an interesting discussion???

-adam

Granted , he violated a federal law, and he is now paying for it, not just probation that effects his business in the reptile industry, but he also paid a HUGE fine. I think he also did some jail time too, but cant be sure of it.

However, it does not change the fact that he does have great quality animals and great customer service. That is why I would purchase from him again. No matter the crime, why should one let this tarnish his good name as far as reptile quality and customer service? Give the guy a break, he messed up, but does it mean he has crappy animals, heck no..... it means just that, he messed up. I give him the same consideration I would give to you had you done the same and knowing you too have quality animals and customer service.

Is this a moral issue to you maybe? If it is, I understand, but bottom line, if a reptile breeder/supplier has a good name as far as thier animals and customer service stand in the reptile industry, thats where I am gonna go, because I want quality animals when I do make purchases. Now maybe you think this is wrong, but I am being honest.

[Adam_Wysocki]

None of that had yet happened when I made the purchase - I dare say it hadn't happened when Jeanne had either so it could not reflect on their helpfulness or the quality of the animals at that time.

But Jeanne stated that knowing what she now knows, she would happily purchase from him again ... that just go me thinking ... what level of crime would deter a person from buying something from a vendor?

The dime bag to kids is a far far fetched stretch of an analogy.

Maybe so, but the point was to help figure out if there is a "level" of criminal activity that makes a person undesirable to buyers ... is there? ... It it's not the violation of a federal wildlife statute, what is it then? ... A DWI? ... Drug possession? ... Battery? ... Murder? ... Where does the average reptile buyer draw the line?

Would you suggest anyone who has been charged with anything be eternally blacklisted as a seller?

I have no idea? ... I think that it's societies place to say, not mine ... I was just asking a question in response to Jeannes statement that even though she is aware that Don has been charged (and convicted???) of violating a federal law that she would still do business with the man. It just got me thinking about what kind of crimes a person would have to commit to turn buyers the other way.

I wasn't accusing anyone of anything ... just asking a question for the purpose of discussion ... sorry that it was off topic.

-adam

[Jeanne]

None of that had yet happened when I made the purchase - I dare say it hadn't happened when Jeanne had either so it could not reflect on their helpfulness or the quality of the animals at that time.

The dime bag to kids is a far far fetched stretch of an analogy.
Would you suggest anyone who has been charged with anything be eternally blacklisted as a seller?

was the question - and the responses were valid I think.

This had not happened yet when I made my purchase, so I cannot base my opinion off of something that happened after the fact, so my statement about his business was based off my of experience alone.

I cant help it, but I just dont think to blacklist a seller eternally is right.

[Smulkin]

We can have a "Meet the Press" forum if we want to but only if I get to be Tim Russert.

Reply to OP.

[Adam_Wysocki]

No matter the crime, why should one let this tarnish his good name as far as reptile quality and customer service?

No matter the crime? So hypothetically, if a breeder with a fantastic reputation and amazing animals made the mistake of getting in a car drunk and killed a child, would that tarnish their reputation or should they still be given a break. It's a stretch, but I find it hard to believe that there is no line that can be crossed that would make a person turn the other way no matter how good the service or the animals?

Jeanne, please don't take this as me suggesting you are right or wrong ... I myself don't really know where I stand on the issue ... I have some very good friends that have done some shady things and it is certainly very troubling ... I was just really looking for more of a discussion about what makes a seller a good seller and should their personal acts outside of the selling of reptiles bear weight on a buyers decision to do business with them? .... Is having great service and amazing animals enough or do consumers hold sellers to a higher standard?

Am I losing everyone on this ... I'm really not trying to stir the pot ... just asking a question.

-adam

[Smulkin]

OK kids.

Splitting this topic now.

sigh

[Adam_Wysocki]

Start a new thread - that was not the point of this one.

I figured if I crossed the off topic line too much you guys would split it off into a new thread ... I've seen the done a bunch of times ... I thought given the discussion about Don's mistake within the thread my question was relavent.

But alas, I really didn't want to ruffle feathers so I'll retreat to answering questions about sheds and poop.

Thanks for humoring me.

-adam