BP always hangs out in the open

[Blam18]

So, my daughter accidentally let Levi fall off the bed. Could he have broken ribs? It was maybe a 3 foot drop at the most onto carpet. So now, for the last couple days he does not go into his hides hardly at all, if ever. He lays loosely in the open, a lot of times with his head elevated and resting on a large branch. Would that mean it hurts to ball up in his hide? Husbandry seems to be on point. He'd been hiding normally up until this event.

He's just over 100g
In a 20 long, 80 low, 91 high
Hide each side
heat lamp on thermostat
Humidity 40-60

Thx

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[Jbabycsx]

My completely uneducated guess would be unlikely. When I kept my ball in a tank he would climb to the top and fall over and over again. Granted it was only a 19 inch fall, but it never injured him. I’ve seen snakes on videos fall from treetops in the wild and slither away unscathed. Hope it’s ok!


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[dakski]

It's possible. However, even if he broke one, or a couple, of many, why would he then be in the open? Wouldn't he want to hide and heal, knowing he's vulnerable?

Let me see if I understand the following:

1. You say temps are 80F-91F, correct? How are you measuring temps? Specifically, with what device? Are all your heating elements regulated with a thermostat? EDIT: I just saw you have a heat lamp WITH thermostat. However, I want to make sure that's the only heating element and I still want to know how you are checking your temps.

2. He has two hides. What kind of hides, how big are they, relative to him? Are they identical?

3. Humidity 40-60%? How is that being measured? That's a big range? When is it 40% and for how long? When is it 60% and for how long?


Question of the day?

Is Levi making any noises? Does he keep his head elevated for long periods of time and even sleep with his head elevated? Do you notice any discharge from his nose or mouth? Does he have a runny nose? How long have you had Levi? Where did you get Levi? Has he eaten for you? Has he eaten recently/since the fall or since he started keeping his head up?

If I had to guess, the fall is not the issue, but the low humidity and/or temps could be off is the issue. When a snake chooses to be in the open over safety of a hide and seclusion, especially a BP, (there are exceptions to this rule such as Carpet Pythons, many Boas, etc. often enjoy being out and seeing what's going on etc.) and is keeping it's head elevated, it's usually the beginning of, or he/she has, a Respiratory Infection (RI), or, on rare occasions, can be getting neurological damage, but that is very rare and comes with more, and severe other symptoms, and usually much hotter temps than you are describing.

BP's should have humidity in the 60% range. Too high can cause an RI and too low can cause an RI, especially if temps are off too and/or their are other stressors (new environment, too much handling, etc.).

40% qualifies as way to low for any extended period for a BP. 60% as a high is really just in their comfort zone. If you said 55%-60%, I'd say, fine. It's winter, no problem. Same, if you said in the summer, 65-70%. However, in the same vein, if in the summer, you said 80-85%, I'd say, too high.

Please answer the questions so we can better help you figure out what's going on.

[Blam18]

It's possible. However, even if he broke one, or a couple, of many, why would he then be in the open? Wouldn't he want to hide and heal, knowing he's vulnerable?

Let me see if I understand the following:

1. You say temps are 80F-91F, correct? How are you measuring temps? Specifically, with what device? Are all your heating elements regulated with a thermostat? EDIT: I just saw you have a heat lamp WITH thermostat. However, I want to make sure that's the only heating element and I still want to know how you are checking your temps.

2. He has two hides. What kind of hides, how big are they, relative to him? Are they identical?

3. Humidity 40-60%? How is that being measured? That's a big range? When is it 40% and for how long? When is it 60% and for how long?


Question of the day?

Is Levi making any noises? Does he keep his head elevated for long periods of time and even sleep with his head elevated? Do you notice any discharge from his nose or mouth? Does he have a runny nose? How long have you had Levi? Where did you get Levi? Has he eaten for you? Has he eaten recently/since the fall or since he started keeping his head up?

If I had to guess, the fall is not the issue, but the low humidity and/or temps could be off is the issue. When a snake chooses to be in the open over safety of a hide and seclusion, especially a BP, (there are exceptions to this rule such as Carpet Pythons, many Boas, etc. often enjoy being out and seeing what's going on etc.) and is keeping it's head elevated, it's usually the beginning of, or he/she has, a Respiratory Infection (RI), or, on rare occasions, can be getting neurological damage, but that is very rare and comes with more, and severe other symptoms, and usually much hotter temps than you are describing.

BP's should have humidity in the 60% range. Too high can cause an RI and too low can cause an RI, especially if temps are off too and/or their are other stressors (new environment, too much handling, etc.).

40% qualifies as way to low for any extended period for a BP. 60% as a high is really just in their comfort zone. If you said 55%-60%, I'd say, fine. It's winter, no problem. Same, if you said in the summer, 65-70%. However, in the same vein, if in the summer, you said 80-85%, I'd say, too high.

Please answer the questions so we can better help you figure out what's going on.

1 - I have a digital thermometer on the cool side, always indicates about 79-82 range. On the warm end I have the thermostat attached to the heat lamp, set at 91 and it's digital thermometer is always in the 89-91 range. No other heat source.

2 - The 2 hides are not identical, but both are small plastic ones, very snuggly fit for him. He's always loved the hide on the warm side. He'd be in it almost always up until now.

3 - Humidity I've been struggling and struggling with and I know optimum is about 60%. The humidity gauge is part of the digital thermometer I have on the cool end, with the sensor right in the middle. I have 2/3 of the tank lid covered with saran wrap and foil. I have cypress mulch, sphagnum moss and a larger water dish. I spray daily, but usually by the time I get home it's in back down the 40-50% range and I spray again, so the low readings are not for an extended period of time. I live in Florida for crying out loud, so this humidity issue is frustrating, but the heat lamp is just sucking the life out of the humidity. He had a bad shed a week or 2 ago, but the herp shop I got him from took him in for a few days, did a good soak overnight I guess and fed him. He's been looking good since we got him back. I know the risk of an RI due to too low or high humidity, which is why I'm so frustrated.

4 - He is not making any noises, no discharge from his nose. As of yesterday I noticed his head being elevated in his tank all of the time. I woke up several times last night and looked in and he would be in a different position, but his head would still be elevated one way or another.

5 - We've had him for a couple months. He's been a good eater. Ate last Friday and plan on feeding again today because he's a bit skinny. I'm curious to see how it goes.

[dakski]

1 - I have a digital thermometer on the cool side, always indicates about 79-82 range. On the warm end I have the thermostat attached to the heat lamp, set at 91 and it's digital thermometer is always in the 89-91 range. No other heat source.

2 - The 2 hides are not identical, but both are small plastic ones, very snuggly fit for him. He's always loved the hide on the warm side. He'd be in it almost always up until now.

3 - Humidity I've been struggling and struggling with and I know optimum is about 60%. The humidity gauge is part of the digital thermometer I have on the cool end, with the sensor right in the middle. I have 2/3 of the tank lid covered with saran wrap and foil. I have cypress mulch, sphagnum moss and a larger water dish. I spray daily, but usually by the time I get home it's in back down the 40-50% range and I spray again, so the low readings are not for an extended period of time. I live in Florida for crying out loud, so this humidity issue is frustrating, but the heat lamp is just sucking the life out of the humidity. He had a bad shed a week or 2 ago, but the herp shop I got him from took him in for a few days, did a good soak overnight I guess and fed him. He's been looking good since we got him back. I know the risk of an RI due to too low or high humidity, which is why I'm so frustrated.

4 - He is not making any noises, no discharge from his nose. As of yesterday I noticed his head being elevated in his tank all of the time. I woke up several times last night and looked in and he would be in a different position, but his head would still be elevated one way or another.

5 - We've had him for a couple months. He's been a good eater. Ate last Friday and plan on feeding again today because he's a bit skinny. I'm curious to see how it goes.

Get a temp gun ASAP. Those digital thermometers are not very accurate and not giving you ground temps where Levi is. The temps are probably different than you think.

I would also recommend identical hides.

When you spray/mist, do you do so with hot water from the tap or room temp or cold water?

Please advise and get a temp gun and get proper ground temps ASAP.

[Blam18]

craigafrechette - Thanks! I'll try that. I do think that last night that he did get turned upside down when a blanket was moved and I don't recall him having any issues correcting himself. I'll try your recommendations tonight, tho, to be sure.

dakski - I'll get a temp gun. It's been on my list, so I'll make it top priority. I spray with room temp water. I fill up the bottle and leave it by the tank. I guess sometimes I'll use it right after I fill it from the sink so it'll be cooler water, but not cold. I'll make the hides identical, too.

On a side note, this last weekend we found a stellar deal at the flea market for a 40-ish gallon reptile tank with stand and many accessories included for $100. Great deal, so we jumped on it knowing Levi's going to need a bigger tank as he grows. Should we hold off on moving him into it for now? I know he would need a lot of "clutter" right now so he would be comfortable in such a large space....

[Craiga 01453]

To address the potential injury situation you can do two things:
1) place the snake on his back and see if he's able to flip himself over without any difficulty.
2) hold the snake by his back 1/3 of his body, towards his tail. If he moves around easily he's likely uninjured.

I would hold off on feeding until you are confident no injuries were sustained in the fall.

[Craiga 01453]

I would also hold off on moving him. I would wait til he's about 500 grams bef9re moving him to that big a tank.

[Blam18]

Good to know about the misting water temp. Thank you! I do make sure I don't spray him directly. I try to focus on the moss so it'll soak it up and then mist the cypress mulch substrate. I want to make sure I don't saturate it too much and get a soggy wet moldy mess on my hands.

75% of the screen top is covered. The open space is just large enough for the heat lamp. It is an infrared heat lamp, not a CHE.

[Blam18]

Well, Levi ate last night, so that's a good sign! I thought the pup was even a little bit big for him, but he got it down okay. After he ate we put him back in the tank and covered him with his hide in the usual spot and he's stayed in there just fine. (To feed, we put him in a separate container on top of my daughter's PET mouse cage so the scents get his juices flowing. Works well!) We'll see how he acts the next couple days. I hope he stays put and digests comfortably.

My hubby picked up a temp gun at Home Depot - Ryobi, I think? Well, reading the instructions it says it can have a variance of +/- 5 degrees Celsius...not sure what that translates to in Fahrenheit, but that doesn't seem to be a very reliable tool with that much variance. Do we need a different brand?