Update on "Beginner just got a Burm."

[melissafred]

As luck would have it, I caught the pet shop owner today when she was taking care of the animals (they're closed on Sundays). I explained what happened and she immediately agreed to work with me. She did feel that the clerk thought I knew more than I did (How, I'll never know. If someone asks if you have a book on snakes as well as what type of housing they need, they are CLEARLY new to snakes) and that he's not the type to intentionally lie to someone. I'm still bothered by the fact that he recommended the Burm to us as a first snake. When I see him again, I'll say something good naturedly but pointedly about NEVER recommending a Burm as a first snake, no matter how docile he is as a 5 month-old. The owner said she'd swap snakes, give me a store credit, order a Corn - whatever I want her to do. Told her I'd bring him back tomorrow morninng (wasn't planning on catching her this afternoon so didn't have him with me).

They have a year-old male California King. Didn't mind being handled but definitely an escape artist. They realized that he was out when they went to show him to me. Luckily, the escapee was caught while still in the reptile room. What can you guys tell me about these guys? My understanding is that the males will go 3-5 feet. This one looked to be about 2 1/2 to 3 feet. Gorgeous markings - black with yellow. She also has a couple of baby Balls.

Thanks for all of your help. I've learned more in 24 hours than I have in the last 6 months. Time to go research the Kings.

Melissa

[normballpython2]

well it depends what you are more interested in pythons or colubrids. i am a ppython guy all the way(i also like boas lol) but if you are a colubrid guy i would still go with a baby king/corn anyway just cuz it's a lil more fulfilling (IMO).

here's a care sheet for kings
http://ball-pythons.net/modules.php?...warticle&id=14

here's one for balls
http://ball-pythons.net/modules.php?...warticle&id=52

and here's one for burms just in case ya wanted some more info
http://ball-pythons.net/modules.php?...warticle&id=16

have a nice one

Brian

[melissafred]

well it depends what you are more interested in pythons or colubrids.

At this point in life, I just want an easy-going, easy-care snake that won't get big enough to require it's own room. I enjoy snakes and find them very interesting. I also think the right snakes make great pets. However, I have no intention of turning this interest in snakes into a multi-thousand dollar life-altering extreme hobby. I view our relationship with a snake just as I do with the 2 dogs, the guinea pig and the fish we already have. We love them dearly, give them the best care that we possibly can provide, treat them as valued members of the family and will keep them with us until they go on to pet Valhalla. However, just as I have no intention of having 5-6 Shih Tzu's to go along with the one we currently have, I have no intention of owning half a dozen herps of varying degrees of difficulty. I grew up in the country with a father who was terrified of snakes and was taught to fear them. However, a wonderful biology prof who was also a herptologist helped me see the light. I want my children to respect snakes but not to fear them. I feel that the best way to accomplish this is by allowing them to have one as a pet and teach them the difference between venomous and non-venomous snakes.

Please tell me this is the right attitude to go into snake ownership with.
Melissa

[frankykeno]

Here's a few links from breeders and such. Some have prices associated with different colors/patterns of kingsnakes or caresheets.

http://swreptile.com/kingprice.html

http://www.greatbasinreptiles.com/html/calkings.html (some really nice pics!)

http://www.vmsherp.com/CarePages/CareCalKing.htm

http://www.newenglandreptile.com/CareCalKing.html


~~Jo~~

[Python-77]

I would go with the Kingsnake, they are very forgiving if care needs get a little outa wack for some reason. They are also much better eaters. The Down side to a king is they are probley the world best escape artists above any other snake I have owned. They are a more slender snake than a Bp and do tame down pretty well though some can be hissy when in there enclosure.

[frankykeno]

Personally I think that's an excellent attitude Melissa and I would think that with proper information you're family will do very well with an appropriate snake.

I've found our 2 ball pythons to be excellent additions to our busy household. They have taught my own children respect for a creature often feared by others, to be patient, calm and respectful of these unique animals that are so unlike a dog, cat, pet rat, etc. Also with their eating habits the children are seeing the predator/prey interaction (tho we feed pre-killed the snake still strikes and coils as it would a live prey item). The lessons of patience especially are interesting. To watch them learn that they cannot hold the snake whenever they feel like it (especially during the "no touch" first week or so) and 48 hours after it eats. Also since they are nocturnal, the kids learned to go with the snake's cycle as far as daily handling.

They will even remind me if I have one of the snakes out and haven't immediately noticed it looking antsy....very funny when my 12 year old says..."mom the snake's had enough" LOL.

Our snakes are a part of our household, just like the other pets (fish & pet rats *not food*).


~~Joanna~~

[mlededee]

...However, I have no intention of turning this interest in snakes into a multi-thousand dollar life-altering extreme hobby... However, just as I have no intention of having 5-6 Shih Tzu's to go along with the one we currently have, I have no intention of owning half a dozen herps of varying degrees of difficulty...

that's what i thought too just over a year ago when i got my first ball python (which was also my first herp other than the anoles). oh how quickly things change! your attitude is great and i think the addition of a snake will be a fun and rewarding one for your household.

[melissafred]

Thanks Joanna and mledee.

Regarding the no-handling rule. The Cali King that we're interested in has been at the shop for a while and has been handled a lot, which I'm guessing is why he didn't show any signs of unpleasantness with me today. Assuming I get him tomorrow, he'll be alone for a good 5 hours until the 12 y/o gets home and will be by himself every day for at least 8 hours per day. Do you guys think it will be a problem if DS and I hold him a little bit each night for the first 3-4 nights, as long as we watch for signs of stress?

Also, we're going to keep the cage we bought for the Burm (roughly 3'x2'x4' and all screen mesh). From what I'm reading, this guy will appreciate the length of the cage. I'm going to get him a hide as well as a tree limb to stretch out on. Do you think the cage will be ok or should we try to enclose it at least partially with Plexiglass?

Thankyouthankyouthankyouthankyouthankyouthankyou.
You guys on this board have been tremendously helpful and a sanity saver.
Melissa

[frankykeno]

I'm sorry Melissa I'm not at all familar with all mesh cages or if they are appropriate for king snakes other than you obviously know they are lil escape artists. Hopefully someone else here can help you with that issue.

As far as handling I know it's tough to hear...leave the snake be for a week...and you really should do what you think best but all the best advice we got here was to set up the cage, pop in the snake and other than fresh water and checking for waste, leave it completely be for the first week.

Think of it this way, the snake had to adjust to that pet store, now he'll have to adjust to your home. If you give him time to adjust in his own snakey way then offer him a nice juicy mouse (btw what has he been eating? frozen/thawed, pre-killed or live? what size mouse?) you're really upping your chance for a successful first feeding.

Once you get him feeding well, then gentle daily handling is a great thing in my mind for both snake and human. Just remember to give him 24-48 hours after a feed with no handling.

I know it drove our family nutsy that first week but oh has it paid off with our snakes. They both took their first feeds perfectly and haven't missed a step since and are lovely to handle. Again tho this is only how we do it, not the only way to do it.

Oh btw have you gotten something yet to hold the mouse when you offer it to the snake?

Found this for you when I did a general search on what to look for when purchasing a king snake. Hope it's of some help....

Things to look for in a healthy snake:

• firm rounded body
• clear eyes (may be a little cloudy if about to shed), no discharge from eyes
• no signs of mites (check especially around head/eyes, look for dusty specks on body, check hands after handling snake)
• no open mouth breathing or gasping for breath
• inside of mouth uniformly pink (reddened areas or cheesy looking matter may indicate mouth rot)
• shiny smooth skin with no scabs or sores
• clean vent with no swelling in area
• should move smoothly with no tremors

A new snake may not be all that tame, but should settle down fairly well with gentle handling. A snake that is distressed will wave its body in the air trying to escape. Most king and milk snakes will settle down after a bit and wrap itself gently around your hands."


~~Joanna~~

[Python-77]

The enclosure is it a Reptarium? If so I would not advise keeping a snake in that since they are zipper shut a motivated snake could work his way out were the zipper closes.
Snakes are solitary animals and need little to know human interaction. The tolerate us more than they like us, some tolerate us better than others. I would leave him alone untouched for the first week or so to settle in, I know this will be hard for a 12 y/o but its best for the snake.