Thinking about breeding

[erebus45]

Ok I have one ball python atm but here shortly I am getting another my local pet store 2 blocks from my house and the only pet store around within reasonable driving distance is going to Shut down within the next 2017 year I want to start breeding mice yes I could just stock up on f/t but he ate frozen one time and has refused ever since iv tried everything iv read every forum and nothing has worked so I'm stuck on feeding live so I figured why not breed my own iv got the space iv got the money and iv got the skill to build my own rack so why not.... Now my question(s) are since I will only have 2 snakes how many tubs do I need how many males and how many females and what kind of rat should I get I would love regular white lab rats but I know their are different kinds I also would appreciate input on bedding, food, and tube size any help is very very appreciated.... Thank you in advance

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[melcvt00]

So you want to breed rats, but posted in the mouse forum?

[erebus45]

Well at the time I thought it was kinda the same technique lol I wish this thread would disappear along with some others of mine lol.... Sorry

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[Eru_Iluvatar]

Mice and rats reptoduce really easily and will have big litters considering you have only 2 snakes, of course you can then supply food to friends of yours or as pets for children, but giving it a try is worth it, even just for the experience.
What I did to start was buy 2 females and 1 male. I put them on separate plastic tubs high enough that they wouldn't escape, in a ventilated place, I bought a big bulk of wooden shavings and I changed them 2 times a week.
I fed the mice fruits, vegetables and different types of cereals.
I could really go on forever, so take a good thought about it at let us know if you really want to, because you can find different methods and tips

[erebus45]

Mice and rats reptoduce really easily and will have big litters considering you have only 2 snakes, of course you can then supply food to friends of yours or as pets for children, but giving it a try is worth it, even just for the experience.
What I did to start was buy 2 females and 1 male. I put them on separate plastic tubs high enough that they wouldn't escape, in a ventilated place, I bought a big bulk of wooden shavings and I changed them 2 times a week.
I fed the mice fruits, vegetables and different types of cereals.
I could really go on forever, so take a good thought about it at let us know if you really want to, because you can find different methods and tips

I currently have two sets of 1 male and 2 females mice like you in a 8 tub rack system I made using vision tubs.... the first set of 1.2 I have iv had for about a months now the second set iv had for about 1 or 2 weeks with no luck and whats funny is one of the females in the first colony had babies and weaned them about a week before I got her. so technically IMO that means she is a "proven breeder". I feed all of them kaytee fortified diet for mice and rats that I order from amazon I also like you bought a bulk bag of aspen they have food and water 24/7 and I clean the cages once a week to reduce stress plus they don't really smell like at all I have them in my room and lot once have I noticed a smell. it seems like In one tub he wants it but the ladies don't and in the other tub idk cuz like I said 1 or 2 weeks since I got them lol I cover them at night so it is completely dark and warmer since its winter time.... I am completely open to any tips or tricks you have to breeding mice

p.s. I have three snakes now lol.... and the extras I plan on selling to some people at work that also have snakes but don't want to spend ~4 dollars at petco/petsmart since that is really the only thing around.. oh and I plan on seeing if my local co-op will order in some muzuri 6f for me so I can feed them that instead of kaytee thank you

[Eru_Iluvatar]

Don't buy at petco/petsmart. Massive breeding in poor, degradable and nasty situations is really a big issue these companies have and don't really want to change.
If you breed your feeders it is the best way to go, if time, money and will let you, of course.
I have a personal policy, and that is to give the best quality of life as long as they live, so I keep them at the best, not like pets but in really good condition.
Now it's all a small production on its own, Like I said, I started with 1 male 2 females, I introduced the male to the female and soon enough she got pregnant, I removed the mouse for 2 days on its own and then introduced him to the other female, same result there.
I never put a water bowl because they tend to cover it with the wood shavings, so I tied a mouse watter bottle to the side of the tub without them beaing capable to remove it.
As for the food, I tied a plastic (rectangle shape) to the wall of the tub aswell so I can place the food there and it can't be in direct contact with the bedding, risking it to get burried, I mix the food all together because they do select the things that they prefer and that is really not whats the best for them.
They have a small hide where they put the litters in, and I put some newspaper so they can chew, play with it, and build a nest.
If you're breeding mice, I would encourage you to try rats, and here are a couple of reasons:
-They reach sexual maturity at 5-6 weeks
-They're in heat 4-5 days a week!
-Females reach menopause at 1 and a half year, so by that time it probably has been mother to at least 30 babies
-Being in heat for all that time, you can leave them 8 to 10 days so they will have at least 2 cycles together
-The max time for a female to give birth is 28 days, so you will be producing a lot of babies.
-They grow bigger than mice in less time, this is really important, beacause your snakes will grow too and they will need more chuby preys

[Stewart_Reptiles]

Breeding is somewhat similar you can expect the same length of gestation, same number of babies.

What gets easier is that there is hardly any cannibalism.

When buying make sure to buy small rats barely weaned 4 to 6 weeks max and grow them to optimum weight of 250 grams before pairing them. Because they reach maturity at 4 to 6 weeks does not mean they should be bred at that time it's too early for the females.

For good rotation you will need one female rat per snake, now with a limited amount of snakes I would recommend that you switch your snake to f/t first, rats grow very quickly and by the time they are 6 weeks of age they are too big even for the biggest BP (I euthanize anything that has not been fed off at 6 weeks, 8 at the very most which means I keep some animals on F/T for that sole purpose)

In your case I would have 4 tubs, 1 female in tub 1, 1 female in tub 2 and keep the two other tubs for hold back/grow out.

Tub size: small concrete mixing tubs from home depot - Bedding: pine bedding works great you can also combine it to pine pellet. - Food: you are looking for a food with 18% protein and no red die (check your feed store)

Never put two males together (unless you are gowning them and they grew together from a very young age), never put more than 1 male with females.

Avoid harem breeding it takes it's toll on the mother very quick for obvious reason since they are gestating while also nursing and it also take it's toll on the babies (smaller, weaker litters)

Once pregnant I remove the females and put them in an individual birthing tub to prevent injuries to the babies, rats are great mothers but because they are such great mothers they will often fight over the babies and until they are 5 to 7 days of age severe injuries and death can occur. Once they are 5 to 7 days mother and babies are placed in a communal tub.

Separate the rats from their mother when they are 3 to 4 weeks (I let large litters over 12 stay with their mother until they are 4 weeks)

Once production falls below 10 the female is retired.

I started my breeding colony 10 years ago with petco and petsmart rats since my options were limited and build it from there, I now produce a couple thousands of rats each year every year, it's all about selevtive breeding, holding back the offspring coming from well tempered individuals, from large litters etc. I have everything from self to hooded, dumbos, agouti, black beige and albinos.

Make sure to provide something for the rats to chew on (a piece of 2x4) will do, and if you have chewers they must be culled (that includes the chewers and tub mates) as they will teach other rats to do the same.

[Rikoku]

Thanks Deborah, that was really informative and we are in the process of buying a house ATM and based on your information I am highly considering breeding my own when we move in.

[Stewart_Reptiles]

Thanks Deborah, that was really informative and we are in the process of buying a house ATM and based on your information I am highly considering breeding my own when we move in.

No problem if you have additional questions you can also PM me.

[erebus45]

Thank you to both eru and deb for the informative post it was will needed and much appreciated.....Thank you

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