Ambient temperature higher than surface temp??!

[Keshi]

Hi all,

i am new to bp's and this forum so please bear with me.
I've kept king snakes before but having trouble getting the husbandry for a bp right so any advice would be appreciated greatly.
i have a piebald bp, 10 month old, at first set up was great, 60% humidity, 35C ambient temperature, 90f hot spot and 80f cold spot. Over time the ambient temperature has risen to 40C, the surface temp has fallen to 85 on the hot side and 75 on the cold. Even with these changes, my bp has decided the hot side was too much and discovered the cold hide. Now she never comes out when she used to be active, I left her to see if she'd return to the hot side but hasn't even come out to drink. I had to get her out today to see if she was ok and she was freezing to the touch. Placed her on the hot side and she perked up and had a drink and returned to the hot hide. Now the humidity has fallen to 30% and no matter how much I mist it, it never rises. I have forest floor mixed with sphagnum moss, I've added a 3rd moss hide and still no luck with daily misting. She is in a 20g aquarium with moonlight bulb with the thermostat set at 88f. When I turn the heat down the humidity rises but if I want to achieve 90f hot spot the humidity is just massively low.
Complicated to say the least and I need to solve this ASAP. Thank you guys.

[Felidae]

Hi,
If you use light bulb for heating, the ambient temp can be upper than the surface temp. I don't know what you use to measure it, but maybe the problem is here. The aquarium is screen top?

[Keshi]

Hi,
If you use light bulb for heating, the ambient temp can be upper than the surface temp. I don't know what you use to measure it, but maybe the problem is here. The aquarium is screen top?

thanks for getting back to me so quickly. No it's a wooden top with glass doors. I've got a dial gauge at the mouth of her hide and a dial temperature and humidity gauge on the back wall. The thermostat probe is at the back of her hide.

[Keshi]

Could it be possible an infra red bulb would dry the air less? And also provide less light stress???

[Keshi]

What's bugging me is surely she knows how to thermoregulate, so why is she choosing to make herself freezing when she could just go to her hot hide and warm up? Man i just wanna get this right!

[200xth]

thanks for getting back to me so quickly. No it's a wooden top with glass doors. I've got a dial gauge at the mouth of her hide and a dial temperature and humidity gauge on the back wall. The thermostat probe is at the back of her hide.

Analog gauges can be very inaccurate sometimes.

[Felidae]

It make even more drier the air in my experience. Before you try to fix it, get digital thermo and hygro meter, and if you want to measure more accurate the surface temp, use temp gun for. That analog things are really inaccurate. You need correct measurements to set up the thermostat. If you still have humidity issues, better to use UTH instead of bulbs.

[kitedemon]

It is likely a combination. The inexpensive dial gauges with paper face cards are very poor quality and often the paper swells and traps the needle.

Ambient air temps should be measured with out influence of the heater. Most heaters used in reptile keeping are radiant heaters and they effect objects far more than air. The result is if the ambient air temp is measured under/above or in contact with the enclosure it is not a true reading. It is not likely you have air temps exceeding the surface temp. Possible just rare. Lamps vary there are 'heat lamps' that are radiant heat sources and others that are convection.

Judging by the info you have provided it is more likely that your placement is being adversely influenced by the lamp. Try moving the thermometer out of line of sight of the bulb and up off the floor (it doesn't need to stay there just temporality.) usually about ⅓ -½ up from the floor and in the middle or off centre towards the cool side.


RH this to me is a huge indicator that you have a not ambient air temp reading. RH is relative to temperature, and at 35ºC 6-% RH is 23.9 gm/m3 absolute humidity. This is a massive amount, almost unbelievable. If your ambient were this high and your room where the enclosure is were below 78 it would be condensing water. If you had 100% correct numbers and you did drop the ambients down to correct levels the RH would be around 110% so everything would be covered in water. (dew point is over the actual temperature) again possible but not likely.

The accuracy or placement or both is the most likely culpret.

[Keshi]

It is likely a combination. The inexpensive dial gauges with paper face cards are very poor quality and often the paper swells and traps the needle.

Ambient air temps should be measured with out influence of the heater. Most heaters used in reptile keeping are radiant heaters and they effect objects far more than air. The result is if the ambient air temp is measured under/above or in contact with the enclosure it is not a true reading. It is not likely you have air temps exceeding the surface temp. Possible just rare. Lamps vary there are 'heat lamps' that are radiant heat sources and others that are convection.

Judging by the info you have provided it is more likely that your placement is being adversely influenced by the lamp. Try moving the thermometer out of line of sight of the bulb and up off the floor (it doesn't need to stay there just temporality.) usually about ⅓ -½ up from the floor and in the middle or off centre towards the cool side.


RH this to me is a huge indicator that you have a not ambient air temp reading. RH is relative to temperature, and at 35ºC 6-% RH is 23.9 gm/m3 absolute humidity. This is a massive amount, almost unbelievable. If your ambient were this high and your room where the enclosure is were below 78 it would be condensing water. If you had 100% correct numbers and you did drop the ambients down to correct levels the RH would be around 110% so everything would be covered in water. (dew point is over the actual temperature) again possible but not likely.

The accuracy or placement or both is the most likely culpret.

I just want to say a massive thank you to all who responded so quickly on behalf of my snake! I went down to the exotics shop and bought a digital temp and humidity gauge. After setting that up it was reading 78% humidity!!!! Although the temps were just a tad too high . I am absolutely bloody outraged that these dial probes are allowed to be sold, it would have been detrimental to my snake and I am so angry you wouldn't believe it, I could cry literally.
hopefully now she will be much happier.

[Felidae]

Don't be angry. Now will be okay