Different Types of Boas

[Amaya K]

Okay, this is a little bit like a rant, but I'm hoping a few people will reply with more information and kind of agree with me, because man am I peeved. I already greatly dislike the way most people just group all boas together, like, they aren't different species? I mean, a Kenya Sand Boa grows to be a couple feet long, and a Red Tail Boa hits 7ft easy. I'm not super knowledgeable about boas, I've mostly been working with Royal Pythons and Corn Snakes since those are the two I own, but even I know to do some research before even considering a new pet.

So there I was, going through Craigslist pet section, looking for a scratching post for my kitty and a bigger tank for my corn. Not in a big hurry to buy either, so hey, might as well just scan them all right? Well I see an add for a baby "Dwarf" Red Tail Boa. That strikes me as odd, when I've heard a reptile store owner friend of mine complaining about how people think "dwarfs" exist. I mean, I suppose there could be an obscure, smaller range of red tails out there, but from everything I've heard, know about genetics, and have researched on the internet for an hour, they don't exist. Red Tails are a breed of snake, and that breed has genetic markers that allow their size to vary between adults. If such a thing did pop up, it would be very inbred, or at least this is my impression unless someone can tell me otherwise. So what do I do? I email the guy telling him such, very politely and under the impression that he's just a poor guy who was lied to by whoever he bought it from. I mostly just don't want this poor animal to get sold to someone who doesn't expect it to reach a size they can't handle.

Well this guy replies very meanly, if I do say so, telling me he got it from a reputable breeder and all and finishes by telling me that I "shouldn't stick my nose in other peoples business" and should "learn before I speak because then I'll sound smarter" all misspelled and poor grammar. He then claims he has a "Panamanian" Red Tail that he says only grows to 5-6ft. I don't know about that, I didn't look into it much, but then I checked his add again and it no longer said "Dwarf" it said "Panamanian Red Tail"

So I guess I'm just asking if anyone else has more experience with this, either Dwarf Red Tails and if they exist or not, or if region they are from can make a difference in expected size. I'm just really mad at this guy, if nothing else for being so rude about it. Has anyone else had similar problems with people not being clear or wise about their type of snake?

[Daybreaker]

Panamanian boas are a smaller locality of BCI that do top out around the range he said. Some do consider them dwarf boas, as some consider Central Americans, Nics, Hog Islands, Tarahumaras, Crawl and Caulker Cays, and other desert and island localities. Some individuals from some of these localities can still get up there in size similar to Colombian BCIs, but I haven't seen any of these guys reach the sized of BCC localities and BCOs.

When you say "Red Tails are a breed of snake", are you talking about BCC localites or BCI localities and what specific localities/species?

[hypnotixdmp]

The first thing I think of with this is that a BCC is a TRUE red tail boa, and I have heard a lot of people refer to BCIs as a "red tail boa". That being said, maybe the owner just wanted a pet and the breeder just said its a red tail boa that doesn't get that big, which the Panamanian does stay pretty small. Or, maybe he listed it as a dwarf boa, because it stays smaller, to try to get someone who wants a smaller snake to be more interested?

I researched and they are a smaller boa species, so it makes sense. Would I post it that way? No, but others may, and as long as its not a true BCC trying to be sold as the Panamaniam then I don't think there SHOULD be an issue with his post.

[Amaya K]

By "Red Tail is a species" I was just trying to emphasize that it isn't a description, it's the name for an animal-- like the difference between calling a dog a Poodle or black. I just see many people who don't do their research act like a Red Tail is just how a snake looks when they're trying to rehome or sell one they weren't prepared to own.

My two biggest concerns with this guy's add was 1) that he could have just explained calmly that by "Dwarf" he meant "Panamanian" and then added the name to his add for clarification. That's what I would have done. Instead he called me stupid and accused me of not knowing what I was talking about when it was clear he didn't do his own research. My other issue was that he didn't post any pictures, so I have no idea if this snake is what he says it is. I was mostly worried that he was making it sound smaller just to sell it.

Thanks for the info guys, I was just mad at a jerk and since I don't work with breeding at all or Boas beyond volunteering at a reptile store, I was just trying to sort through it all with a little help.

[DTK]

Dwarf boas exist.. I've got a male caulker cay, he's definitely a dwarf. Maybe not a red tail, but he changes color so in my book that's even cooler Sounds like he was rude, but hey, it's Craigslist. All kinds of people come out of the woodwork for craigslist. You did the right thing trying to inform him, but he must have took what you said as an attack.

[Daybreaker]

Maybe he simply took your email in the wrong tone? You could post what you sent him if you like.

And you could consider "red tail" a description (not one I agree with mind you): it's a very broad term that many pet stores and those unfamiliar to other boa localities use for ALL boas. It's not really correct IMO: the only "true" Red Tail Boas are the BCC localities. I don't consider my Colombians, CAs, Hog, Longicauda, or Argentines "red tails" because they aren't. But for those not familiar or new to different types of boas use "red tail" as a blanket term.

[Amaya K]

I know some species of Boa have dwarfs, from what I've read they're ones that have been found on islands of their native territory and are smaller as a result? I've just never heard of a Red Tail Boa being a dwarf. The first page of google is full of "They don't exist" which is why I posted this

[Daybreaker]

I've never heard of true BCC red tail boas (Iquitos, Pucallpas, Guyanas, Surinames, Brazilians, and Venezuelans) being dwarfs either.

[Amaya K]

Quoting my exact email to the guy: "Um, excuse me, but from all the research I've been doing I was under the impression that there was no such thing as a "Dwarf" Red Tail Boa. Perhaps someone tried to make a Hybrid with a different species of Boa, or the person you bought it from lied to sell it? It happens sometimes. If this is really a true Red Tailed Boa, it is perfectly capable of reaching its expected 7-8+ft size, and it is a little irresponsible to advertise otherwise. I just don't want someone to buy a snake expecting it to fit in a 40 gallon tank all its life and end up with something they aren't prepared to handle. I'm just emailing to let you know"

And his response has enough crude language I'm not going to post it without a lot of blacking out. My original tip off was mostly that it's still a baby and he's already trying to sell it. Does anyone know if there's a price difference for a Panamanian Red? He was only asking $60. Altogether I was afraid he was either scammed himself and trying to fix it, or trying to scam someone else

[Raven01]

I saw a guy on kijiji trying to sell a "Rainbow Tree Boa". His photo showed a standard BCI. Chances are pretty high the husbandry was off if he was that ill informed.
The case you found doesn't sound anywhere near as bad.