Big News Coming Tomorrow!

[TheSnakeGeek]

With that said... ONE viable clutch out of HUNDREDS does not mean the problem is solved. There have still been a LOT more desert females killed in breeding attempts than this one possible success. Odds that I do not see as worth it for the animals.

i do agree with this.. if this actually IS a desert female.. i would not have even announced this until i had raised the female offspring up and they produced viable clutches.. and when they did, i'd be rich.. any other way and you could just be putting thousands of desert females in danger. that way it would work out for both you and the animals.

[majorleaguereptiles]

First, congrats! This looks like it could be very exciting news! I figured I would chime in since many people have asked for my thoughts on this female. First, Amir has a great eye and has been doing this for a long time. This female was produced from a super citrus, which means the base for pastel vs pastel desert should have been even that much more distinguishable. I see her as a pastel desert, and would have sold her as one just as Amir did.

The only hint of doubt for me at this moment was the fact this may be a citrus pastel that didn't take on its genetic appearance and perhaps had a developmental issue that gave her more pronounced color and contrast. However, I'm not really seeing incubation effect with her in any extreme fashion and I personally think she is simply a pastel desert.

Those who say she doesn't look bright enough, if you've seen adult deserts, they really aren't nearly as bright or striking as they are as babies...

I believe this female is a pastel desert. Now, whether or not the eggs go full term, I don't know. We also need to see a desert come out of these eggs... I'm plugged in, and very excited to see this outcome.

Great job by the OP documenting this properly. I believe it is the owners discretion whether or not you choose to breed your female deserts. If you believe it's unethical, I respect your argument. However, we have to remember the very little time frame these deserts have really been bred in captivity (albeit with bad results), but only account for a few generations of breedings. I think if people wish to pursue their time, money, and energy to breed them I have no problem with it. These animals would breed naturally in the wild, and I can assure you none would raise their hands to declare themselves as non-breedable pets.

Many snake species have had captive breeding problems that took many years to figure out, and even breed out.. This OP paid his money for this snake, so obviously he cares about the safety and well being of the animal. Personally, I'm very excited for him and good luck!! Keep us posted!

[snakesRkewl]

One snake dropping a clutch, if it's a desert which I'm kind of skeptical of, doesn't change the grande scheme of things.

Carry on ...

[irishanaconda]

Looks like one to me? Either way grats on the eggs. I hope it is a desert pastel!! How big was she?

[behindblueyes]

I am torn about this thread. The desert gene is incredibly beautiful, and to see females able to breed without complications would be an amazing turn of events.

However, like some have mentioned already, I am worried about all of the desert females that will perish as a result of many people rushing to unlock the gene. It is bitter sweet really. On one hand, there may be hope, but on the other hand there have been many deaths and many still to come.

I understand wanting to "unlock" the gene for scientific satisfaction. But in doing so, many animals have and will lose lives.

With that being said, I don't work with this gene, and can't say one way or another wether or not I see desert in that female. She sure is pretty, and her pattern and clean saddles look desert like to me. Plus, with Both Amir & Major League chiming in, I believe what they say. SO, if this IS a desert gene sitting on eggs, congrats by all means. BUT, I'd keep EVERYTHING back, or at least the girls like others have said as well and see if they produce safely, and if so, I'd do it again another year just to be sure, annnnnddddd then it *might* be safe to say you've stumbled on a safe line of the desert gene.

Congrats and good luck

[SaintTawny]

These animals would breed naturally in the wild

And after a few shot attempts, assuming everything we've documented so far besides this clutch with Deserts is representative of the morph and its problems, those members of the species carrying this gene would die out and it would disappear from the pool. Natural Selection is quite good at taking care of "problems" like infertility. Don't get me wrong, I'll be excited for combo possibilities if we prove Desert females to be viable in some way, but it rubs me the wrong way that anyone is still putting the life of their pet on the line to try to prove it out. Yes, it's your pet to do with as you like, for the most part, but if I put the life of my dogs at risk in a similar manner to make puppies, I'd get investigated and probably shut down by the SPCA or the Humane Association, and rightly so. If this really is it, and for OP's sake I hope it is, then great, but the odds are more like that it's not, or that it's a non-repeatable fluke.

[Badgemash]

So do I win a baby for guessing correctly?

(Just kidding, unless you actually want to send me one, in which case I'll pay for shipping )

[majorleaguereptiles]

Natural Selection is quite good at taking care of "problems" like infertility.

Of course. Natural selection would probably take care of just about every morph we own in the wild.

it rubs me the wrong way that anyone is still putting the life of their pet on the line to try to prove it out. Yes, it's your pet to do with as you like, for the most part, but if I put the life of my dogs at risk in a similar manner to make puppies, I'd get investigated and probably shut down by the SPCA or the Humane Association, and rightly so. If this really is it, and for OP's sake I hope it is, then great, but the odds are more like that it's not, or that it's a non-repeatable fluke.

I own an English Bulldog, a breed that is still bred despite many problems.

Again, I understand the dilemma here with people breeding females deserts if this happens to be viable...

I'll be honest, if deserts pop out of these eggs, I won't be running to buy and breed desert females myself. I'd be more inclined to sit back and see if the offspring were viable, and if this female could do it again next year, etc... Maybe make a super desert, and then if this line proved successful, I'd then consider getting back into it. That is just my own take at the moment, however as an enthusiast, I really am excited.

[Seth702]

My .2 cents worth. Being new and one whos still learning all the aspects in the breeding world I find it very sad to see so many negative opinions pop up so fast on this project. I hope that the OP can prove this out and that the desert project is one step closer to viable. One thing about science or projects of any kind is keeping an open and optimistic mind set. Forming such a firm "its impossible" conclusion from a single bad picture is very disappointing. I wish the best of luck to the OP and hope to see many future updates when these hatch out.

[I-KandyReptiles]

My .2 cents worth. Being new and one whos still learning all the aspects in the breeding world I find it very sad to see so many negative opinions pop up so fast on this project. I hope that the OP can prove this out and that the desert project is one step closer to viable. One thing about science or projects of any kind is keeping an open and optimistic mind set. Forming such a firm "its impossible" conclusion from a single bad picture is very disappointing. I wish the best of luck to the OP and hope to see many future updates when these hatch out.

The negative opinions are based on what many people have already tried to do with the desert females. So many have died from becoming egg bound, eggs aren't vital, and more issues.

Of course people are going to be skeptical and I'm disappointed they didn't just keep this to themselves until the eggs actually hatched.

So many people are going to try to breed their desert females now and many are going to die!